Hostess- Bye Bye Twinkies

[phatdaddy]

good thing they have a shelf life of about 100 years

mj, sounds like when my parents got older, before we could get them any help, they had to impoverish themselves, with a 5 year lookback.

[smokeonthewater]

It sounds like MJ got a heck of a bad deal but to say that jobs go overseas because of the unions is really unfair and there are quite a few non union people that didn't get the retirement they thought theyed have due to things beyond their control... I am a pipeliner and a member of operating engineers local 450.... I make a little less money than the non union pipeline operators but I get health insurance and am vested for a pension after only 5 years although it would be a small one if I didn't work any more after that.
Our jobs go overseas because the cost of living in this country is WAY higher than in China or Honduras and we won't work for 25 c/hr and because our government taxes the snot out of everything we do but goes easy on big companies importing entire ships of cheap chinese goods and passes crap like nafta that helps pave the way to outsource labor... I for one feel that HUGE taxes on imported goods would fix the problem.

I don't know any of the twinkie details but if they actually folded over $10 a week that is a pretty dumb move BUT it wasn't the fault of all unions but rather a mass of people who voted against a contract.

I have worked both union and non union and have absolutely nothing against anyone working either way.....

[RidgeRunner]

There are a lot of factors driving US companies to buy or manufacture overseas. Not to single out unions at all, there are dozens of other reasons to move manufacturing overseas. The world moves on dollars, cheap labor due to the relatively cheap cost of living is one of the major attractors to move production plants overseas. I don't have a problem with the people (union or not), or unionization when it makes sense.
I would assume pipeline work requires you to work wherever they need a pipeline so moving it overseas probably isn't going to happen. On the other hand, Twinkies can be made anywhere and don't require skilled labor so why not move it all to Mexico where labor is cheap and the workers aren't unionized. Much simpler to deal one on one with your workforce than with the shop stuarts, organized labor and all the complexities of labor negotiations. (Not to mention- OSHA, DOR, DOL, IRS, EPA, DOA, FDA, DOH, 100,000 laws governing your every move as a business including being required to offer healthcare and workers comp for every employee here in the USA)
You gotta sell some serious twinkies to pull that off.. Just saying.

[Destroyer]

Originally Posted by smokeonthewater

I make a little less money than the non union pipeline operators but I get health insurance and am vested for a pension after only 5 years although it would be a small one if I didn't work any more after that. I for one feel that HUGE taxes on imported goods would fix the problem.

That must be a local kind of thing. I can tell you first hand that union workers (carpenters, plumbers, ironworkers, electricians, etc) in the tri-state area make (on average) a third to twice more than what a non-union worker makes. All our state contracts must go to union workers because their pay is considered the "prevailing wage" specified in state contracts. Even though we could (for example) pave our streets for a third less than what we are paying we are forced to pay the higher wage. (And in the process the non-union contractor and his workers are forced out of putting in a bid since the workers are not getting the "prevailing wage"). Unions are in bed with the government and vice versa.. That's why they want to maintain the status quo.

Gotta disagree with you on the huge tax increase on imported goods thing. Like any other expense, the additional cost would only be passed along to the consumer, and, at the same time, the governments of the imported makers would raise their own taffifs against American goods, so our manufacturers would not realize any additional sales.

And like you, I've been on both sides of the curtain as a union and a non-union worker. I feel that if a person wants to be in a union then more power to them, but, if a person doesn't want to be in a union then they should also be allowed to work without any penalties placed against them. Everyone should have the right to work as they want.

[chumbucket]

Even though the union representing the Hostess workers played a big part in the shut down by refusing to concede to certain issues during negotiations, they are not soley to blame. I read that among many factors, a big issue was a Federal Sugar Tariff placed on food corporations producing snack foods.
Thanks to the Obama administration. This crap is just going to keep getting worse folks. Get used to it. Wait until Obamacare kicks in.

[jasoncooperpcola]

nevermind