No more middle class???

[reelapeelin]

Originally Posted by willy

There is truth to what you say Oz, the enemy of our Republic has only one label, it is called Progressives.
The only caveat I would add to your pronouncement is this.
The Democrat Party has been almost completely co-opted by the progressive fringe, not my words, the words of Democrats running for re-election this year. The few that got re-elected did so by promising to fight against this agenda.
None of the Republicans are being supported by Move On Dot Org,-The Tides Foundation-The AFL-CIO- SEIU- the Communist Party USA-Socialist Party USA and dozens of other entities in the media which are bought and paid for by George Soros.
None of the Republicans meet with the Shadow Government Project (literally what they are called) funded by Soros, to organize the down fall of the Republic and to force civil unrest so that the U.S Gov has no choice but to make sweeping changes in violation of the Constitution seizing power.
No my friend, though some like Lyndsey and Olympia are Progressives that pretend to be moderates, even they do not attend these movements meetings and make speeches. it is the Obamination, Pelosi, Reed and all the other Democrat politicians and leaders that are there enmasse.
With their hands out for money and support. Hillary was one of Soro's darlings that helped him set up Move on Dot Org, and several of his 501C3's, she speaks at all these Soros organization meetings all the time, she is on tape doing it repeatedly, so are a whole bunch of Democrat Pols.
if any of you guys have been watching Beck you will see them, in their own words, on tape, repeatedly saying these things, and our so called Fourth Estate, The Press is intentionally ignoring it because they also have the same agenda.
That is why Beck is vilified in the media, why Fox News is literally come under attack from the Whitehouse, the freaking Whitehouse attacking and organizing opposition against a news agency. Have you ever even heard of such a thing in America. You do now, because of the enemy at our gates,
they are called Progressive's, Socialist's, Fabian Progressive's in England and here, Communists, Left Wingers, and several other names, including much to my sorrow and many of my friends in the know sorrow, Democrats.

What about the newly elected Republican Representative who railed against health care during his campaign...caught on camera beetchin' about the fact that HIS GOV'T insurance coverage doesn't start for a month...wanna talk about pretenders?...

You say the enemy of our republic are the Progressives..I say it's apathy on the part of those who are caught up in the POLITICAL debate, when it's a GOVERNMENT ISSUE...the point is being MISSED and that's just the way THEY want it...as long as we are down here in the trenches fighting amongst ourselves about left vs right, THEY WIN!!...WE LOSE!!...

[willy]

No one here being apathetic, no one in this election was apathetic, did you see ALL the results, I ask that because a lot of it went un reported by the drive by media.
The largest single victory in history of State Representatives, 486 state house and senate seats changed hands to republican, including hundreds that were in Democratic hands for over three decades.
Governors in states controlled by democrats for decades now Republican.
In 2006 democrat take over of the house with a 36 seat change was called a landslide, a monumental change on the will of the people.
In 2010 the House changed hands with a 64 seat change with I believe a few still pending.
The Tea Party, vilified by the Democrats, mocked, threatened and lambasted by the major media, was the single biggest influence in all of this across the country. They are regular folks like you and me, fed up with the Progressives and what they are doing to our country, regardless of party affiliation took to the streets peacefully, organized, and voted. In the grand tradition of American Citizens standing up for our nation.
No Sir, no apathy here.
No apathy when a TV talk show host can organize the third largest gathering in history on our nation's mall without a political agenda, or support for a political party, no, just an idea of Restoring America and our belief in One Nation Under God.
No, no apathy among all the people I spoke with over the past few months, they are angry, they are scared, and they are tired of what is happening to our nation.
They are going to hold these Republicans and Demo/socialist's feet to the fire.
And maybe some who wish to save it, might do something about organizing American Democrats in to taking back their party, cause right now they are being run by those who would destroy our way of life, destroy the Constitution, destroy the Republic.
And the real biatch of it is the masks have come off and they are all over the place talking about how they are going to do it. On video, in print, in their own words.

[Seacurity]

I had this conversation with someone about 6 months ago. I used to own a thriving Exotic Car Customizing business that did really well for me and my family. I even had a TV show on ESPN! Money wasn't an issue. I have since lost the company, my house, my cars and everything I had worked hard to build up. This was 2 years ago and I am back on my feet now working a job (I haven't worked for someone is 8 years!) making not much more than I did when I was in College. However, thankful to be working!! I am a former teacher and former Air Traffic Controller with multiple degrees and a vast background. I totally believe that, especially here on LI, there will be the lower class barely making it and the upper class thriving off the lower class. It's a rather in depth discussion/debate but being a victim of this I feel first hand where we are headed. This is the reason I am selling my 2 larger 27' and 29' cabin cruisers and getting a smaller trailerable boat that I can afford and manage myself without paying haulers and storage fees. God Bless America!!! ...............

[RWilson2526]

Willy, here is my problem with Glen Beck...I've been watching his show lately and this is where I disagree. If someone has any desire to implement or even discuss anything that is traditionally labeled "progressive" he paints a broad brush and calls them "communists or socialists" and all the bad parts of those movements that came along with them in our world history. ( not to mention the dramatic way he does it like we should all be so appalled)

Let me ask you this and be honest...if some how magically every person in this country, or world for that matter could be taken care of medically with quaility care, and it was somehow paid for equitably wouldnt that be just the best thing ever? Or if we had a world economy without politics involved where now instead of having 300 million US customers I could sell my widgets to I had 6 billion people without having to worry about trade laws and embargos and taxes and all the other bull**** that our world politics brings with it.

Call me a progressive or communist or whatever you want but in THEORY universal healthcare and a world economy would be a GOOD thing but with the "current world order" it will never happen. You have to admit our current worlds political system is rediculous. But if you imagine changing it you just said basically that you want a "new world order" and Glenn Beck automatically says that means we are not at the top of this order and the world will come to an end.

The problem is with our current political 2 party system is someone cant even attempt to dream about that kind of thing without being called a "Socialist or Communist" by the Republican party and the whole machine comes to a grinding to a halt.

[Destroyer]

Originally Posted by RWilson2526

Willy, here is my problem with Glen Beck...I've been watching his show lately and this is where I disagree. If someone has any desire to implement or even discuss anything that is traditionally labeled "progressive" he paints a broad brush and calls them "communists or socialists" and all the bad parts of those movements that came along with them in our world history. ( not to mention the dramatic way he does it like we should all be so appalled)

Nothing wrong with a little showmanship. If what he is saying is the truth, then how he says it is not important. I like him simply because he is so dramatic. Who wants to be watching a boring college professor type of person give you tons of facts without any emotion. He backs up everything he says or writes about with video tapes or recordings or whatever... He's not lying like most politicians and "newscasters" you see today. I see him as a deeply religious, almost finatical patriot that is trying to educate people to what is happening in our Country.

Let me ask you this and be honest...if some how magically every person in this country, or world for that matter could be taken care of medically with quaility care, and it was somehow paid for equitably wouldnt that be just the best thing ever? Or if we had a world economy without politics involved where now instead of having 300 million US customers I could sell my widgets to I had 6 billion people without having to worry about trade laws and embargos and taxes and all the other bull**** that our world politics brings with it.

No, I don't think it would be, and I'll tell you why. The simple fact is we are all humans, and, like everyone else, I would love to just sit back and have everything given to me for free. When you give everything to everyone for free it destroys incentive. It makes you lazy. And when you become lazy you don't care about what people are doing as long as you are getting "yours". But what happens is that not everyone is a purist, driven by an overwhelming need to help their fellow citizen. Some people are simply greedy. Be it for money, fame or power, they want more. And the way they get more is by controling you and having you work for them.
Sure, they will give you some "benefits" like "free" health care (that you are really paying for anyways)...but while you are eating hot dogs and hamburgers and being happy that you have food they are traveling around the world dining on lobster and steak that you paid for. Don't you see Rob? It's a trap. They are setting a trap for the entire Nation...

Call me a progressive or communist or whatever you want but in THEORY universal healthcare and a world economy would be a GOOD thing but with the "current world order" it will never happen. You have to admit our current worlds political system is rediculous. But if you imagine changing it you just said basically that you want a "new world order" and Glenn Beck automatically says that means we are not at the top of this order and the world will come to an end.

I won't call you any of those things. I'll call you my friend if I may. Perhaps a bit naive, but my friend nevertheless. No, even in theory universal health care and a world economy is not a good thing. Our Country didn't become as great as it was by leaching on the backs of others. It was only by hard work and perseverance that we got where we are. And if we want to stay at the top of the heap, then that's how we do it. As soon as we start looking to the government to provide us with things we start losing our freedom. The more they "provide", the more we lose. In the end, they have everything, they control you, and you have nothing. I'm really not ready to give up my freedom just yet.

The problem is with our current political 2 party system is someone cant even attempt to dream about that kind of thing without being called a "Socialist or Communist" by the Republican party and the whole machine comes to a grinding to a halt.

I've dreamt about it several times... it's called a nightmare. I have no desire to have someone take the fruits of my labor and give it to someone else that isn't doing a damn thing except holding out their hand. I'm not toaking about the injured or people that are mentally challanged.. I'm talking about perfectly healthy people that are playing the system. Why should they work when they can get everything for free?

I don't think it's the Republican party anymore that's driving the car. It's the Independants. The Tea Party activists, if you need to call them a label. They are the ones that are trying to halt the machine. And thank God they are. When over 80% of the people say they are against health care and our elected representives still decide to vote it in, then it's time to realize that they are not representing us, the nation. They are representing the special interests that are funneling hundreds of thousands of dollars to them. They are (in my humble opinon) traitors that should meet the same fate as any person the betrays their country and their countrymen.

We all need to pray to whatever God you believe in for guidance and for salvation. Without his help, I fear that our Country will be lost to our children and their children for centurys to come.

[Seacurity]

amen!

[Blue_Runner]

I believe life is what you make of it. If at any point we get fed up with this country, guess what???

There are over 190 countries in the world to choose from!

[RWilson2526]

I've dreamt about it several times... it's called a nightmare. I have no desire to have someone take the fruits of my labor and give it to someone else that isn't doing a damn thing except holding out their hand. I'm not toaking about the injured or people that are mentally challanged.. I'm talking about perfectly healthy people that are playing the system. Why should they work when they can get everything for free?


Points well taken. But what you have up there is exactly the Glen Beckian thought that I am talking about. Your taking a potentially workable idea and throwing it out without discussion because you dont want to see lazy bastards get something they dont deserve.

And I could not agree with you more about that and without a shadow of a doubt those people exist and are benefiting from alot of Democratic polices that are in place now. I'll be the first one to tell you that 99 weeks of unemployment is too much. We occasionally lay guys off that have worked for us (although never for lack of work, just because they suck or are a pain in the ***) and its comical how just about when unemployment is running out you hear they are starting to beat the bushes looking for work......they'd have been looking alot sooner if they new that next check wasnt coming.

So because we have a percentage of the population that are dead beats working the system we are going to dismiss health care reform that could possibly help many people. I dont think the problem is the idea its the execution....2000 pages long and that jack *** pelosi saying you'll have to vote for it to find out whats in it.

I personally know alot of working class people that strictly CAN NOT AFFORD DECENT HEALTH CARE FOR THEIR FAMILY. And its just plain wrong....but we are going to ignore all those problems because we dont want some scumbag gettin a free ride....how about we do something about it and then find out how to get the scumbags off our dime....


When my son broke his leg the total billed to our insurance company was $32,000 for a broken leg. Fortunately for my family our health benefits are outstanding (through the evil teachers union) and did not cost me more than about $50 out of pocket for some co pays.....the insurance company paid about $22,500 which the providers accepted as full payment. Now if I didnt have insurance how much would I have owed, 22,500 or $32,000? Who the hell knows....Ask any insurance actuary how to get insurance rates down and they will tell you to get a bigger pool of customers. Have one insurance company instead of the amount we have now and rates will drop.

Another big part in the healthcare reform is mandatory digitizing of patient records....With my moms current illness a myriad of doctors came in ordering test upon test....fortunately my sister being an RN and there every day with her was able to point out on about a half dozen occasions that that particular test was just ordered by the last doctor and completed. A complete waste of money......

All these things need to be fixed but there are those that wont even address the damn bill because they think its a slippery slope to nationalized medicine by the "obamination"....

It's rediculous.....yes this country is in trouble because of all the labeling bull**** and stereotyping generalizations that politics has become....and I would rather be on the side wanting to change it than the side that just wants it be the way it used to be. Things will probably never be the way it used to be...This is not the 1930's isolationism or the 1950's post world war with a vast open country and vast amounts of natural resources....its not the era of the tech boom where businesses flourished putting a pc on every desk and a cell phone in every hand and a dot com on every screen....times are changing and we need to as well.

I will be the first to admit I am naive but I would like to call it optimism. I refuse to admit there is an evil empire in the white house right now that wants to chain me like a dog to work for him.....I'm just not doing it.