Transom and floor repairs
 

I just bought a 1990 V20 fisherman which is generally in great condition though I am concerned that there is a crack in the transom above the uppermost engine connection bolt; we are taking the engine off and will take core samples to see if the transom is good or not - if no problem will just reseal everything. If there is an issue we plan on cutting the transom out from inside to the outer skin so as not to ruin the gel coat on the outside as it is pristine and then rebuild the transom from the inside.

My question really is there is a soft spot in the floor in front of the front console seat that needs to be repaired; what is the best way to do this? Cut it out and reinforce it and then put the section back and repaint the floor or is there a better way? The soft spot is about 24" wide by 12" deep (bow to stern)

I have a similar issue with the cover above the gas tank. It is basically rotten.The rest of the deck is solid so it is just a matter of unscrewing the gas tank cover and building a new one. Has anyone else repaired/replaced this part? Thanks.

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bacchus60 .. i have the same soft spot in the same area .. if you are sitting on the cooler seat in front of the console, the area is right at your feet. it is not the gast tank cover as that is under the console. i thought it was soft as the tank is under there and not a lot of reinforcement. that is the only spot on the floor that gives when you walk on it.

i was waiting to get the tank out to see what i could see .. let me know if you come up with something on your end. i would like to fix this issue as well.

If your wanting to replace the transom from the inside and have a soft floor issues your might want to think about taking the boat apart and that would give you access to both. I did this on a 1983 CC and it was not all that hard but not sure about a 1990.

Repairs
 

I am thinking about pouring the transom as after reading the threads I think I can do this; however I am still left with the floor issue.
Stillrunning how hard is it to seperate the top from teh hull. This boat is in immaculate condition other than the transom and floor. So the debate is pour the transom and cut the floor or seperate the top from the hull????????
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Very sweet looking V congratulations, there are a few post here in regards to the top removal process, I am not experience enough with a CC sorry

like ny, not that familar with the center console, but if the stringer system is similar to the cuddy. there is a large void between the forward bulkhead of the fuel cell compartment and the bow. you probably got water intrusion where they screwed the console to the deck and that is the largest span between stringers. you could put a 4 or 6 inch deck plate in that area and that would let you look in the area and see what your up against. i think i would avoid pulling the cap if i could.

put the deck plate where the soft stuff is(depending on how big it is, it might take care of the soft spot, at least you'll know what your dealing with

I agree with those prior that reccomend an access cover "look see" before jumping in.

The only way I have been able to address this issue without pulling the entire cap is outlined in a previous theard I posted

http://www.wellcraftv20.com/communit...ight=aquasport

It does require basic fiberglass skills and will leave a access cover with approxiate a 1/4 inch elavated lip. However, it can address a large soft spot in a deck while providing access and storage you didn't have avialable before (think battery well)


Kamikaze

We just disconected and labled all the wires that run through th floor to the CC. Disconnected the steering and throttle cables and then removed the CC. You will also need to disconect any gas lines and lighting wires that will be an issue. We then removed the motor and rub rail. Under the rub rail you will find all the screws that hold the two sections together and they need to be removed. We then hooked a rope to the upper deck and rigged a pulley up in a big tree limb and down to my buddies truck. We also went around and popped the two sections apart as they had been caulked together. He just then started to raise the inner section as I watched for any other things that may be connected. After it was high enough to clear the hull we pushed the trailer and hull out of the way and lowerd it back down. One thing to remember is to make sure you use a branch strong enough to hold the weight as that was our first mistake. LOL You then have access to the transom, flooring and you can inspect stringers. Taking the boat apart only took us one weekend but your boat is a different year so all this could be totaly wrong for your boat. I also replaced most of the wiring at the same time but my boat had sunk and need new wires. If your thinking about doing this and would like to talk PM me your # and I'll give you a call.

Pouring the tranny sounds like a good way to go...the soft spot in the floor sounds like a candidate for the Git-Rot repair...a 12" x 24" area?...it requires drilling 1/8" holes on 2" or so centers in the thoughs of the non-slip pattern in the soft area...allow the core to DRY THOROUGHLY and then inject Git-Rot into the holes...it'll set up , then do small gelcoat dabs on each hole and yer done...Google up Git-Rot and rearch the exact hole placement...it may be the way to go...good luck either way ya choose, give us pictures as ya go...:beer:

I prefer KWIK-POLY as it is cheaper and has given me much stronger repairs than git rot. It does cure with quite a bit of heat though when it kicks(not enough to effect the gel coat), but I have found that this dries the wood out a little better.

http://www.kwikpolyllc.com/

Got all the rot out
 

OK Via drill and chain saw I have got most of the rot out and now down to good wood (about a 14" semi circle all the way around the engine mount). Do I need to get all the little woods bits off the inner and outer skins. I am planning on using Quik Poly to saturate the wood that is left before I pour the Arjay. Any good tips? I will post link to pics tonight.

The ARJAY will have to bond to fibergalss, which means ALL of the wood has to come out. The ARJAY will not bond to wood from what I understand and it will fail if you don't get it all out.

Bacchus, where are you located? That's a good Mardi Gras name you have there. I pured with Arjay but I got ALL the wood out per the manufacturer. Find my old post with pics, etc. Spend the extra time and get the inside of the transom clean.

Maury

Update
 

It has taken a long time to get this done mostly because the winter weather in Bermuda has been terrible this winter. However saying that I got most of the wood out of the transom using 3 different chainsaws, a 16" electric, a 18" gas and a 20" gas. Unfortunately I could not get it all but was down to good wood for the most part. This took longer than I anticipated; to those that got all the wood out you are superstars, I don’t know how you did that. I then used QuikPoly (thanks to THEFERMANATOR), this stuff is amazing it pours like water soaks into the wood and makes it bullet proof. I just poured it into the transom and then used a long handled brush to spread it all over the wood that was left, it took about a gallon of the stuff. I used the QuikPoly for two reasons; one to make the wood that was left stronger but also as I believe that the Arjay would bond better to the resin saturated wood better than the wood itself. Then it was on to the Arjay pourable compound. This stuff was also easy to work with (Get several cheap funnels), as noted from others it is a two man job. I did block up every hole, I used a mixture of silicon and then taped it with Gorilla tape; even with all of that though we had a hole we didn't know about nor could we reach. We used a hair dryer to get the leak area to set up faster and then pulled the entire leaked compound out, it was easy. Just a note here initially I only ordered 5 gallons but ended up using 10 so the point being make sure you measure and calculate exactly what you need. So now the transom is rock solid. I will have a link to pictures shortly.

Does anyone know where I can get floor hatches made; a couple of mine are cracked?

Tough find, You may have to build it ?

Gelcoating Arjay 6011
 

Hello all, Does anyone know if you can apply gelcoat directly to the Arjay pourable transom. I have finished and now jut need to make it look good.

No you will need to apply Polyester Resin (not epoxy based) first, then Gel coat. Do a search on here I post an entire write up on resin ..

Nymack, I cant find your post re polyester resin. Are you saying put some polyester resin (maybe with fairing fillets) on top of the Arjay and then gel coat?

I have posted a fwe pics, more to come.

More pics
 

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Please read this carefully, once done you then understand why you will use a epoxy or polyester base filler or jelly to flare it out ..For example if you are going to use Gel Coat to finish it then is MUST be a polyester filler and so on...Below is cut and paste from a Pro not me !!

Polyester Resin
People hear and read things online about polyester resin, epoxy and types of glass, much of it has a grain of truth, but many times it gets blown out of proportion.

Yes, once the resin has cured you get less of a chemical bond and more of a mechanical bond, but there are still reactive sites in the old layup (resin) to bond with. The mechanical bond, while not quite as strong, is not weak and will take a great deal of abuse. You test the bond in the lab by pulling it apart, if it's been prepped well and the bond is good, glass fibers will be torn from each surface, which is common. Sometimes it doesn't separate along the new bond, it may be deeper into the old section or new one, it may also be a combination of the two. If you did a poor job of prep, or if the surface was contaminated for some reason, then the bond may (will) be poor and it may pull apart easily with little or no fiber sticking to each surface.

The most common cause for the line of thought that polyester doesn't bond to anything, is people doing a repair with little or no prep work, sometimes not even cleaning off the old dirt and gunk, then using cloth as the first layer. This type of repair will fail almost immediately and then the resin is blamed. For the best results use a grinder with 36 grit or coarser paper and keep the surface clean.

Epoxy does bond better, the problem is, you still have polyester under it, so if you exceed the stress level the polyester substrate can handle, the epoxy layup will still pull right off, only with some of the polyester still stuck to it. It's almost like the polyester to polyester test, except all of the failure is in the polyester substrate this time.

Mat is used to build bulk and sort of help with the bond. If you use cloth or roving as the first layer, there is a resin rich layer between the glass and substrate, this resin rich layer is weak, Add glass fiber to it and it becomes strong, this is the roll of the mat, the fibers in the mat are random and will fill the area that cloth and roving won't. Now when stressed there is glass near the surface of the substrate, not just resin, so it will not fail like a cloth only layup will. The bond is actually the same, it's just that the resin isn't failing near the bond line now.

Epoxy is much stronger, so this resin rich area at the bond line is not as likely to fail when only cloth is used.

Mat has the lowest strength of the typical types of glass on the market, it's not weak and may add strength and stiffness (don't confuse stiffness with strength), but other types of glass do a better job at adding strength for the same weight. Cloth works well for some things, but I rarely use it and most boat builders don't use it either, as the cost is high for the strength it adds. Roving is strong and is less costly than most other types of fabric, plus it's very easy to work with, so it gets used a great deal. Biaxial type products are very strong and add the least amount of weight and cost more, much of the time they come with a thin layer of mat stitched to them for better bonding and to help hold the resin in place.

There are also two types of glass E and S, E is the most common and is what you will find most of the time. S is stronger and costs more, to buy it you normally need to special order it. When it comes to other high end types of fibers like carbon or Kevlar, use epoxy, they don't work well with polyesters.

Not all polyester resins are of the same quality and neither are epoxies and it can be very difficult to know what you are buying. I'm not an epoxy guy, so I won't give information on it because it may not be accurate.

Polyester boats normally have a skin layer on the hull of a better grade of resin, it may be a straight VE, a VE-DCPD blend, or a straight ISO. This is a thin layer near the gel coat for better water resistance, this layer is commonly chopped, but it may be hand layed with mat. The rest of the hull and deck are normally made with an ORTHO-DCPD blend, it's not as strong or water restant, but costs much less.

What you buy in the store is normally a straight ORTHO, because DCPD's and the blends with it added, have a shorter shelf life and they need a long shelf life for the retail market. You can get ISO and VE resin, but you normally need to go to a fiberglass supply store and ask for them, they will cost more. The VE will be stronger, more water resistant and bond better than ISO, which in turn is better than ORTHO, that leaves DCPD's at the bottom, but they do offer very good surface profile because they shrink less than the other types. Straight DCPD's aren't used that often, they're typically blended with one of the other resins, to lower the cost and help reduce the shrink.

For a typical repair anything but a straight DCPD works well, and you won't be able to buy it, so don't worry about it. Boat builders assemble the entire boat with these standard polyester products, some are chemical bonds and some are mechanical bonds, rarely do they fail. The larger the boat, the more mechanical bonds there are because of the length of time it takes to build them.

Always check to see how the resin and /or gel coat is supposed to be used, does it have wax added, if it has wax in it you need to apply the next layer before the first one gets hard, if it gets hard you need sand and clean the surface very well before applying the next layer. What catalyst % is recommended, what do they say about about adding other things to it. Don't over or under catalyze and always measure it, don't add large amounts of anything to thin them, when you add more than about 5% it can start to have negative affects. Stir well after adding anything, not just a couple swipes with a stick or brush.

While it is important to use good products when doing a repair, it's more important that you use good methods and do it correctly.

Nymack - AWESOME, thank you. I love this site!!!!!!

Great info. on rot treatment
 

I found a little crack inside at the bottom of my transom and probed it - there's some soft material. Found this thread and started researching Git-Rot and ended up on WoodBoatForum: http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?7967-Git-Rot

For penetrating and KILLING the rot, look at the post(s) by Dave Carnell. He's a retired chemical engineer and describes the use of antifreeze for this purpose - it's definitely worth reading. I'd be interested if anyone has comments.

Lumberslinger and I will probably use this info. on jobs - I've got one in mind right now, in addition to my transom.

I'm thinking of hogging out the soft stuff, treating with antifreeze and when it's dry, filling it with a product (to be determined - probably mixed with sawdust0 then glassing over.