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Well it begins
This is the end of private ownership of firearms in our country if passed.
H.R.45 Blair Holt's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009 (Introduced in House) SEC. 2. FINDINGS AND PURPOSES.
SEC. 101. LICENSING REQUIREMENT.
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and for those of you who don't like to read:
H.R.45 Blair Holt's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009 (Introduced in House)
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And don't try to read between the liberal lines and say this is for "gun dealers".
We already have laws in place that the "gun dealers" are having to comply with which is exactly the same as this bill. This is to make the general population gun owners criminals if not complying to licensing. This would be a direct second amendment violation if passed. |
How does a requirement that a gun be licensed interfere with second amendment rights?
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The person is to be licensed.
To be licensed you will have to be qualified not disqualified. Which is in no way the same as a drivers license, had that national argument during the Brady bill fiasco. And I do wish I was a little articulate when conversing over subjects, I apologize ahead of time for not being able to make a good counterpoint. |
when you think about it, more people are killed by cigarettes and alcohol than guns. therefore if i need a gun lisence then we all will need cig and booze liscenses. i like how the guy is using the poor kid that was shot on the school bus as a martyr for his poersonal agenda. Like said above, this is obvious a shoe in to ban all guns. at the end of the day guns do not kill people, people kill people. plus $25 every 5 years. plus i like how if you dont tell the aty gen you moved in 60 days they arrest you. what garbage. what people do not realize is that if there are no guns, people will still be murdered and crimes will still occur.
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Keep posting, I'm not well informed about this. I am a hunter and support our right to own firearms. I don't know what impact the licensing(sp)would have. Post more please! Bill Mac :beer:
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SEC. 102. APPLICATION REQUIREMENTS.
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try this link mac
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c111:H.R.45.IH: on face value it might seem harmless, but I really do not trust the law makers and they tend to be out of touch with planet earth. Plus we all have the right to bear arms not the right to pay to bear arms. |
SEC. 201. SALE OR TRANSFER REQUIREMENTS FOR QUALIFYING FIREARMS.
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SEC. 301. UNIVERSAL BACKGROUND CHECK REQUIREMENT.
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There are already laws in place that prohibit minors, the mentally incompetent and criminals form possessing firearms.
NOW this is a bill designed to make law abiding citizens ALLOWED to posses a firearm. |
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You're right Tsubaki that it is the gunowner, and not the gun, which needs the license. I presume, however, that the gunowner would need a license for each qualifying firearm as defined in the act. I am not a gunowner (although I have no beef with law abiding persons owning guns whatsoever), so I am confused as to what qualifies as a qualifying firearm. The handgun part I understand, but the other part, i.e. "(ii) any semiautomatic firearm that can accept any detachable ammunition feeding device", means nothing to me. Is the bill only aimed at machine gun type weapons or is the definition much broader? Would the definition apply to common hunting rifles and shotguns?
Curious as to what you folks think of lawsuits against the gun manufacturers. The City of Gary, Indiana recently sued gunmakers, and the suit survived a Motion to Dismiss. Gary is or used to be the "murder capitol of the United States", and I guess the powers that be in Gary partially blame the gun manufacturers. I, personally, think the lawsuit is BS |
it seems that they would consider all guns with detetchable mags, even hunting rifles. keep in mind that a .308 caliber in an AR-15 platform makes for a popular hunting arm.
With the lawsuit it shows that people do not accept personal responsibilty for anything there. Why dont they sue car companies and fast food restauraunts in the city. It comes down to the fact that no one owns up anymore and that everyone else is to blame. |
In most EVERY instance this bill applies to every gun owner.
First, ANY pistol. Then ANY detachable magazine. This includes squirrel hunting rimfires to turkey shotguns to elephant killing firearms. The term "antique" doesn't apply to stuff over 20 years old, like automobiles. Problematically "antique" will refer to reproductions of firearms made in the 1800's or newer, made this year (2009) that are capable of the same rounds per minute of "modern" firearms. And lets not get into antique pistols, "it's an antique" but "it's a pistol". Machine guns are (have been since the 1930's) already regulated out of the general populations availability. Read the bill, it sounds great to someone with no idea of the design of the Constitution. This bill would require you to be qualified to be licensed to own a firearm (in actually 2 of the 4 types ever developed) which currently is guaranteed in the second amendment. You MUST be disqualified for possession of a firearm NOT qualified. Meaning by today's standards, underage, mentally incompetent or a criminal. |
This is exactly what many were promised (Brady Foundation, The United Nations Universal Gun Ban, a dozen other Socialist and extreme liberal organizations)
The title of this post is spot on, this man is a socialist, he follows a completely socialist agenda and the nation of our fore fathers and the liberties they fought for are in complete jepoardy. This is not about change, this is not about democrat vs republican, this is about American vs socialist. People need to see this for what it is Thats all I am going to say about it, I am disgusted with what we have allowed to happen and can't do more than vote and call my Peoples Republic of NJ senators and congressmen, who are some of his most ardent suck arses. God help us all. |
Reading the bill further, this will prohibit anyone under the age of 18 to even possess a firearm. I know we're real backwoods in Georgia but many girls and boys under the age of 18 do hunt and target practice here.
Currently in this state anyone under 15 may not be in possession unless in direct supervision of an adult. 16 to 18 years old (you can drive an automobile), if in possession of a firearm, you must be engaged and in route to a firearms type event (hunting, target practice, etc). This bill clearly states no one under 18 will be licensed or may possess a firearm. And my whole ***** about this thing is, now I would be required to apply for a license to be able to carry out my SECOND AMENDMENT RIGHTS. **** it, lets let them work on the First Amendment. You think MJ is a dictating overlord?? And in my ignorance, I only posted 3 of the 9 chapters of this bill. Do go to the site and feel free to read more, it gets even better.............................. http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c111:H.R.45: |
Willy, this is not Obama's bill. He did not write it.
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From what I can tell there is a lot of opposition to this. I'm going to say this bill will go up in flames (along with the author). Or lets at least hope it does.
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Let's make sure it goes up in flames...all of us concerned about this needs to use this link:
https://writerep.house.gov/writerep/welcome.shtml |
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I sat in my wife's uncles living room and told him "there is no way possible this "Brady bill" will ever become law"!
In the original version there were sentences of banning "military type" and "ominous looking in nature" type of firearms. ALL firearms are ominous looking, and I'm still trying to find one type that has ever been developed that wasn't used by the military. Wish I had your optimism Blue. Got a lot more socialists in this ballgame than in the other one. |
And willy, wipe your chin.
You got blood trickling down from biting your lip. |
To follow the progression of this one.
http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h45/show#comments |
And you just don't have enough to get pissed at!
If you live in these states, you are required to destroy all non "encoded" ammunition by July 2011, if passed in your senate. http://www.ammunitionaccountability.org/Legislation.htm This site is designed FOR more imposed regulations on All handgun ammo and All "assault" weapons ammo (which we know includes everything else). Basically after June 2009 all ammo will be encoded as to origination and final sales to person. Any non encoded sales are forbidden after this date. An extra 5 cents per round tax will be imposed above the current "unseen" tax. In Georgia it's 11%. Possession of nonencoded after July 2011 will carry a fine of $1000 for the first offense, $5000 for the second and $10k for the third. http://74.54.61.131/images/misc/progress.gif |
I'm as scared of the liberal anti gun fanatics as any one, but I've been researching on the NRA website for a while and I haven't seen any alerts to any national legislation. The HR45 bill has been beat to death on serveral popular progun sites to the point that the administrator usually locks the thread after posting a link to all the other threads covering the same subject(the bill is over 5 years old and has been shot down several times). The gun shops are telling everyone that the sky is falling and you better buy your guns now, even at Wallmart, they are low on ammo. But when you go to the NRA's website, there is only a few state laws concerning guns that are being posted for review. I have to trust teh NRA to separate teh fact from fiction on the emails and anti gun scares I hear. I personally believe that the anti gun rights groups are going to keep trying, and I don't want to take gun ownership for granted, but for the most part, what we are hearing lately has been some creative marketing by gun manufactures and gun dealers to boost sales. I went inot a gun shop teh other day and overheard a salesman telling a customer that before long, you won't be able to buy new fangled high capicity, high power hand guns like the 1911 he was holding. I just looked at him, the elevated price tag on the Springfield he was holding, and turned and left, with my money.
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Now that is some good and creative marketing right there!
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any of ya'll been in a guns shop lately? They won't even budge on prices, they are list price and some above depending on the demand. The DPMS Sportacal was nationally listed at a fixed price of under $800, shops around here have been selling them above $1000, with a waiting list. Before the election, 40 Glocks were in the 500-550 range, now they stickers are around 650+. The Kimbers have gotten higher(even though they are not high capicity), the TLEII was around $750-$800, In December they jumped to over $1000. Funny thing is, the less popular, but no less quality by any means, guns like the HK's and SIg's are still around their prices of a year ago. It grips my butt that shops I have traded with are gouging on their prices, its one thing to charge retail to make a living, its another to pad the prices based on false speculation and hysteria, sounds a lot the fuel prices from last summer.
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In regards to the SKS I agree, but would add the following, if you have the opportunity, buy the Russian version. All forged, no stamped parts, built like a brick shoot house will fire under just about any conditions and accurate to boot. I know I have one of each, chinese, which shoots darn good, was made for military before they became the rage here, shoots well and tough but compared to the Russian version it feels and looks like a cap gun.
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I guess it all boils down to every time I save enough money to buy that "toy" I want, everybody gets crazy about them and price skyrockets out of my range. It doesn't matter if its for my boat, truck, or any other hobby I have. Of course if I allready have one, no one wants them and they can be found everywhere for next to nothing, I guess I should start collecting turds.
BTW, if you know a FFL or C&R dealer check out http://www.samcoglobal.com/index.html I'd love to have one of those Mausers or a K31 PS, Willy, I haven't heard a thing out of them lately, I think they went away, for a while anyway, nothing has shown up on our report, thanks for the advise. |
Good, Spare. Nice talking with you all, your wife seems like a nice lady.
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How long is America gonna sit here with a stupid look on her face?
A quote: And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand? After all, you knew ahead of time that those bluecaps were out at night for no good purpose. And you could be sure ahead of time that you'd be cracking the skull of a cutthroat. Or what about the Black Maria sitting out there on the street with one lonely chauffeur ***8211; what if it had been driven off or its tires spiked? The Organs would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers and transport and, notwithstanding all of Stalin's thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt! "If. . . if . . . We didn't love freedom enough. And even more ***8211; we had no awareness of the real situation. We spent ourselves in one unrestrained outburst in 1917, and then we hurried to submit. We submitted with pleasure! . . . We purely and simply deserved everything that happened afterward." (Note 5, page 13, Vol. 1, The Gulag Archipelago http://goldismoney.info/forums/image...mazon_icon.gif Amazon , by Aleksandr I. Solzhenitsyn) |
And even more ***8211; we had no awareness of the real situation.
Sounds like the last election honestly |
And before you Goddamn democrats get you panties in a wadd, I'm talking the populous in general as to the candidates in hand.
We were sent NO usable candidates in the last election, this is all America is worth. I thought we were all smarter than this, hopefully we will survive. I expect it, we have never failed. Where is Charlie Daniels? |
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I apologize to ya'll.
The only things in life I do is, work, play with the grandkids, hunt & fish and anything related to hunting and fishing. These attempted further restrictions on legal law abiding citizens to possess firearms and now ammunition has gone way past trying to "protect the children" or "save us from ourselves". It has become a desperate attack on the Second Amendment by anti-gun Nazis. Hopefully this is more stupidity that gets washed off the deck. Somebody please tell me it will be alright and I'm just a paranoid closet Conservative! |
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