Wellcraft V20 Community - How's that "Hope and Change" working?

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- - How's that "Hope and Change" working? (https://forums.wmpdevserver1.com/community/showthread.php?t=20376)

Some one spent way too much time on DU

OMG You actually believe that drivel you posted? 95% of everything there is bogus or is taking credit for things he didn't do. For example, exactly how is Foxconn's building a plant in Penn remotely connected to Pres Obama? The article doesn't even mention him... It does mention the Governor of Penn several times, as well as the chairman of Foxconn... but not a peep about Obama.

And I love the line between 33 and 34 "Brought Much-Improved Transparency and Better Government"
Ummm... his presidency has stonewalled more things than even President Nixon. Things like IRS and Benghazi just off the top of my head. At least President Nixon had the decency to resign when he was caught. And as history has shown, unlike Obama, Nixon was actually a great president in international affairs.

You need to actually READ and research the things you post, not just cut and paste and take someone else's word for it.

(some of) The operative words in those links are things like "tried", "suggested" "initiated", "oversaw" etc, etc, etc... He didn't do ANY of them himself, and most of them he didn't even know about, but just like killing Bin Laden, he and his press corps are trying to take credit for something that his predecessor actually started.

Quote:

Originally Posted by spoggy (Post 215501)

Alright, I haven't attacked anyone here. I haven't accused anyone of not being able to read. I would appreciate the same consideration. I have read these, and I attributed my "cut and paste" to the appropriate source. It just so happens that the majority of what was already collected fit my purposes for this conversation.

As to Foxconn. Reading through the information that is available leads me to believe that they chose to move to the US is a direct result of President Obama's initiative to bring high-tech manufacturing to the US. I'm sorry that you don't agree with everything that has been posted, you don't have to. But, neither do I. And, I don't need to resort to denigrating you by suggesting that you actually have no real idea what you're posting. If you prefer to have that type of discussion, I suggest we take it offline.

Nowhere did I attack you, other than to suggest that you actually read what you are posting. I can bet, almost without reservation, that you did not read all of the 245 items you posted. I never said you could not read, I merely was pointing out that you probably did not read all of that mush. That was the crux of my comment. If you think that was a personal attack, then I apologize. It was not intended to be so. It was, however, a comment meant to emphasize that just cutting and pasting does no one any good, since what you post could be in error, and then you would be helping to perpetuate lies and misinformation, just like those 245 "facts".

As to any posts I make, very rarely do I not include at least 2 separate sources for any claim I make, Re: the poll that showed Obama was considered the worst president in the last 69 years. I only gave 5 examples of his law breaking, and every one of them was researched and are easily provable by even the simplest of internet searches, including Snoops. That's the difference between reading, researching and just cutting and pasting.

And let me ask you a question. If Obama is so guilt free, then why has the Congress of the United States taken up a lawsuit against him for the very law breaking that we are talking about? Partisan politics aside, no one is going to accuse ANY president of breaking the law, especially in print and in public, unless it can be proven. Can't you see that? Do you really think that Obama is above the same rules of law that we have to live by.

Destroyer, "OMG, you actually believe that drivel you posted." Is not hard to be construed as an attack. If that was your response to me I'd take offense, sorry. I know this will probably hurt your feelings, but you can be a little bit of bully in your responses on this topic. And there is a whole bunch of you that say point blank if you voted for this guy you are an idiot or the sheeple or what have you. Again, just insulting to someone who may have voted for him period.

I think I already said this last year but actually didn't vote for him last year because I couldn't take another four years of F U C K I N G whining. Answering Ronald Reagan's question am I better off than I was 4 years ago. We'll, I am. I'm making more money, my health insurance hasn't changed, I'm not paying taxes on my health insurance premiums (remember that whole debate), the ocean hasn't been declared off limits, as far as I know not one of you have had to turn in any of your guns. I'm sorry but the sky is falling crap is making me nuts. 5 years ago we had to listen to how this is the end, come re election time we had to listen to how he was just setting us up for the real screwing.....

And finally you criticize all of the alleged accomplishments but I can sit here and research all of you posted ill doings and come up with probably a reasonable justification for a lot of it.

S h I t I need to stop coming to this political forum

Quote:

Originally Posted by RWilson2526 (Post 215507)

I'm glad things are doign well for you, but not all of us are doing well. We DID lose our insurance in a sense, it got so expensive we could no longer afford and were forced onto the exchange. my wife stil lhas her insurance through work, but myself and my son just couldn't afford it any longer at over $700 a month for basic covers nothing insurance. My wifes pay is about the same, but utilities and essentials cost at least 30% more(if not more) now than they did when o took office. And if you lived down here in the Gulf states, you would believe the ocean has been closed off with all of the fishing restrictions we have endured under o. So some are still doing good, but ALOT of us are MUCh worse off now than we were 6 years ago before o took office.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RWilson2526 (Post 215507)

Destroyer, "OMG, you actually believe that drivel you posted." Is not hard to be construed as an attack. If that was your response to me I'd take offense, sorry.

RW, I think you missed the ? at the end of that sentence you are quoting. I did not accuse. It was not a statement. It was a question. And I fail to see how asking a question can be an attack. If I had said it as a statement I can see your point, and it would be valid I guess, but again I point out that I was asking him if he actually believed something. That's not an attack. I believe it was and is drivel, but that is my opinion and I'm entitled to it.

And there is no need to be sorry. You're my longest friend here, in fact (for anyone that doesn't know) you got me onto this site in the first place. I tip toe around your political leanings and never attack you in deference to you. Always have and always will.

But as to your comment about being better off... Well, Obama-care is just starting to kick in, so it's too early to really see how much damage it will or won't do... but everyone (even NBC) has admitted that it will cost trillions more than originally stated. Our treasury is printing money faster than a speeding bullet. 17 Trillion so far and more coming... and trust me when I say that money is going to have to be repaid... by my kids, your kids, our grandchildren and their kids... Do you realize that right now, every single person in the United States, even just born babies, owes close to $250,000 dollars to the Country? Where do you think they are going to get that money to pay back that debt? Can you say....taxes?

And look at your Utility bills from 6 years ago and now... You and I are on the same grid and we pay the same utility company, and I can tell you that mine sure have not gone down or even stayed the same.
When you pull into the gas pump, do you stop to think that gas is over twice the cost that it was when Obama took office? We become used to certain things and don't think about them, and they (politicians in general, both sides) count on it. There are so very many hidden taxes that we don't even know about... and now they are talking about wanting to tax the internet. (Current federal law bans any state from taxing internet access. But the law expires November 1st. Now the Senate Democrats and a few Republicans are threatening to let the law expire -- and the taxing begin -- if Congress does not allow states to impose sales taxes on internet purchases).

So in answer to your question, no, I am not better off than I was 4 years ago. I make much less, my Medicare was raped to help fund Obama-care, I pay more than double at the gas pumps, food costs are going through the roof, and when my wife retires in a few years we're going to get hit with hundreds, if not thousands more in health insurance costs than we would have 6 years ago.

And I have yet to see a single thing that I am better off about.

Quote:

Originally Posted by spoggy (Post 215522)

Well, my foray into this forum, though well intentioned was ill-advised. I appreciate the support from RWilson2526. Destroyer, I did read all that "mush". You are insulting me by denigrating the material I post and calling into question my ability to understand the repercussions of my "cut and paste". I was asked to give some reasons as to why I like President Obama because I may have been a troll or may be sarcastic. I have never called into question the veracity of the information you have posted, perhaps I should have. I can find errors in almost everything that has been posted in this thread, by everyone. Really, I posted my OWN REAL world view of what has happened since o took office, but it is in error?

As to why the GOP is suing the President? It's political obstruction. I have already shown that President Obama has written fewer executive orders since Grover Cleveland. John Boehner isn't even sure which executive orders they're going to sue over. The GOP is suing the the President for doing his job, running the country when the GOP has chosen to spend all their time trying to overturn laws that their OWN BODY passed. The GOP has tried 50 times since the ACA was passed to overturn it at a cost of some $70 million to the american taxpayers. If the ACA is something that the majority of Americans don't want, how come they can't repeal it? That's just one example. It comes down to the type of EO's he has signed. He has side stepped the governing bodies to push hi s own personal agenda time and time again. That is why they were suing him. Any attempt to have a bipartisan discussion has resulted in the left saying we will only agree to what we want, and not bend. So o took to EO's. If the people didn't want this to happen, then why do these ELECTED OFFICIALS keep getting re-elected to continue to do this? This is what the left just cannot see is ELECTED officials are doing this because this is what there constituants WANT. Almost every pole out there has shown that the ACA isn't favored by the majority of the public, even people who are on it(like myself) would rather be able to afford our own policies. Or better yet, tell me how in 1 single way the ACA has done anything to help healthcare. I have actually used the healthcare system, and the ACA has done nothing at all to address the issues. Sky rocketing costs ARE the issue, and this is why the lawsuits and continued rejection of the ACA come from. It has done nothing but to push this country towards single payer. Almost every study out there has proven that we have jsut as many(or more according to several reports) of UN-insured, yet it is still here despite proving it hasn't done what it was set out to do. And what is going to happen when the REAL costs come out over the next few years?

You have strongly held beliefs, as do I. I haven't been attempting to change anyone's mind, only explain why "I like the guy". I have come to the conclusion that this particular forum is not about the ability to have a free exchange of political ideas and learn about each other, it's a microcosm of the current political climate where everyone is right and has a moral imperative to force their beliefs on others without thinking that the other side has a right to their opinion, and existence.And this is what the left has become renowned for, forcing there views on others. Yes destroyer has strong opinions, but he has explained his standings and backed them up. Not just copied and pasted some examples that look like propoganda. It would be nice to have an actual discussion regarding this matter, and many here would do so. Just back up what you post, not just throw something out there.

This is my penultimate comment in the political forums, I'm sticking to boats and fishing from now on. And this is what many of us have come to despise of the left. Either see it my way or I'm taking my ball and leaving. So many are not willing to see that MANY of us are not better off under our current administration, and are tired of being pissed on and told it's raining. I'm not normally one to foray into the politics forums as I'm not very good at conveying in a civilized manner what I'm thinking(so I apoligize if I come off as attacking you, that is not my intention), but it would be nice to have actual examples of things our administration has done that are positive(not just a copied and pasted list of things). It would also be nice for those on the other side of the fence to realize that many of us have been harmed by his policies, and inability to lead and work with those on both sides of the aisle(the very thing he said he would do when he ran for office in the first place) to help the public instead of polarize it and put us back. If you choose not to post in politics, that is fine(it's stil la free country). But the whole you don't see it my way is a bit over the top.

In red.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Destroyer (Post 215513)

What he has done and is busily doing is "redistribution." He wants to level the results rather than the abilities. Of course he knows nothing, has zero personal experience, so everything Obama believes is the garbage he learned as a kid, taught by communist parents and communist mentors. the FACT that there are no examples in the world wherein people prospered under Communism seems not to phase him.

He will fail to transform America, but he has and will have cost Americans TRILLIONS.

He was allowed to screw us because some here were STUPID enough to believe he would be able to function as a POTUS and help people. That is what is galling. They would NOT listen to experienced people warning that Obama would be a disaster if promoted to President.

I just wish there was a way to make them suffer alone for the damage Obama has done-- and restore the lost wealth and property values for those who DID NOT stupidly vote for that moron.

Larry

Damn, I think Larry is Destroyers evil twin.

If more People would put the same effort into improving themselves and their family as they do worrying about who's gonna be the next new shyster son of a ***** in the white house every four years we'd all be doing a hell of a lot better.