Can't go over 2500 rpm's?

[macojoe]

Ok we got the shifter fixed, works like a charm!!

Now its time for the next issue!! Can't get more the 2500 RPM's on the motor when in the water in gear under a load??

We did a compression test, fine in all 6, Great spark in all 6, Motor starts and runs when 3 plugs are unplugged on left, and starts and runs when 3 plugs unplugged on the right.

BS and I are sure it is electric something, but WHAT??

Any Ideas guys??

Thanks!

[phester]

maybe when fixing the reverse linkage something got out of adjustment w/ the throttle linkage [???] or the timing advance linkage?

[macojoe]

O yea, Motor 1986 225 HP Evinrude Mod E225TXCD Serial B1146525

[tsubaki]

So this is a different motor than the one that was on the boat last week, correct?
Your signature reflects an '87 and this one is an '86.
Has the VRO been gutted? Knowing you, yes.
The parts catalog brings the model up as E225TXCDA if that matters.
Like BS was saying, not sure about the low oil - low rpm safety thing, what year it was implimented but seems to me it was the first year they came out with the VRO system.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.wellcraftv20.com/community/images/statusicon/post_old.gif Today, 05:01 PM
BY bigshrimpin (http://www.wellcraftv20.com/community/member.php?u=97) http://www.wellcraftv20.com/community/images/statusicon/user_offline.gif
God
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Davis, CA
Posts: 1,270


http://www.wellcraftv20.com/community/images/icons/icon1.gif
Well . . . the shift problem is fixed!! Now onto the the next problem . . . the motor won't go above 2500rpm in gear (with a load). I think it's probably the stator, but I'm no OMC guru. I believe the motor is an 86 or 87 and slow mode didn't happen till 1988/89??? any suggestions. There is decent spark on all 6 clylinders when cranking, and compression is even in all 6. We pulled plug wires on one side and the motor will start . . . and then we did the same on the other side and the motor started, so I don't think it's a power pack. Linkage is advancing through the full range of motion. I'm 100% sure it's electrical, but I'm not sure what else to try beside breaking out a multi-meter and going through each component.
Last edited by bigshrimpin : Today at 05:07 PM.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
My '84 had the capability to change to dual fuel pumps but from '86 on out I don't see that option.
I'm not sure how to defeat the VRO system and use the fuel pump disconnected from the oil pump.
It sounds like the VRO system is actually working and preventing it from running over 2500 rpms.
You have an almost identical motor to compare to.
That year model had a remote mounted reservior for the oil, is it possible to have a pair of wires that need connecting to simulate a full tank of oil?

[bigshrimpin]

maybe when fixing the reverse linkage something got out of adjustment w/ the throttle linkage [???] or the timing advance linkage?

I wish it was that, but it's definitely get full advance from the linkage.

[macojoe]

So this is a different motor than the one that was on the boat last week, correct?
Nope same motor, just got the numbers off and looked it up to make sure what it is, and 86 is the deal. And yes VRO is gone long before I got the motor.

Thanks

[bigshrimpin]

http://www.outboardignition.com/page32.asp

S.L.O.W. ***8211; Speed Limiting Oil Warning system. Limits the RPM of the engine to approximately 2500 RPM in
order to reduce the damage to the engine caused by a no oil or overheat condition.

Engines with S.L.O.W.
Engine will not rev beyond 2500 RPM:

1. Use a temperature probe and verify that the engine is not overheating.
2. Disconnect the tan temperature wire from the pack and retest. If the engine now performs properly, replace the temperature switch.
3. Make sure the tan temperature switch wire is not located next to a spark plug wire.

[macojoe]

Just back in from the water, Same thing :cen: Won't go over 2500??

Disconnected the tan wires and it had no effect :cen:

Oils has been disconnected for years so I am sure there is nothing there.

Tied to a empty mooring and cked things out, motor starts and runs great, raced the engine in neutral and it gets full throw and full rpm's, but as soon as you put in gear and load up the motor its still at the 2500??

Why is it for the last few years I get half way threw the season and bam I get screwed??

[nymack66]

Please check for spark on all cylinders, Double check all connectors to your packs; Looks like you are running on 3 cylinders not 6 may be one pack is blown. You will have to test will find it. Also observe the movement of the advance (under fly wheel) make sure it moves freely back and forth. Ferm, Skool where are you guys ? Help !!

[macojoe]

Spark ok on all 6 plugs, all connectors are good, all linkage is moving to there stops, throttle, timing advance, and choke.

Talked to skools on the phone 1 hour ago, he thinks wire harness, or stator?? But says to do the wire harness first as I have some issues there.

I have a brand new harness for the boat side, and BS is going to bring me the motor side. But I have to wait for Friday for him to get here. That's ok going to blow tomorrow and rain all day Thursday.

[tsubaki]

I don't understand how this problem presented itself without some prompting.
Did any wires somehow get arced, grounded or shorted? Normally that would damage a powerpack.
If it was the magnets shifting in the flywheel it wouldn't run or at best run like crap.
Whatever it is, at least it happened in the yard and not offshore.
Look at it that way.

[macojoe]

BS and I were fixing the shifter and had the cowling off and hanging, that might have broke a wire waiting to happen?? There seems to be a few like that, that the old owner just taped up.

[nymack66]

Disconnect both tan wires and ground one at a time to the lock with the key switch on, your buzzer should sound. If no buzzer then its possible the tan wire is currently shorted out shorted (no buzzer working) and is holding the motor within the "low load range of 2500 rpm”?
Also can you turn the prop freely in Natural? Maybe the lower unit is broken and is locking? Reason why I mentioned the lower unit is because of the shifting issue.

[macojoe]

The lower unit is fine right now.

No buzzer so that test isn't going to work, but the book says to disconnect the tan wires from the censors and try it, I did today and still the same.

Thanks!!

[nymack66]

The TAN wire is spliced in the harness you just can’t see it, it connected back to the power packs to limit spark in the event there is a short (over heat, low oil etc) to protect the engine. If this wire is disconnected but still creating a ground it will continue to act like it should in this case limiting you to a low RPM, the other is the buzzer since you don't have a buzzer maybe just maybe this part of its function is working! My thoughts are to unplug the round connector and tone the tan wire out, single pin from the connector back to both ends of the TAN wires make sure it has no connection or fault to ground hope this makes some sense. Also it will not hurt to lubricate the round red plug connector when you unplug it. I really don't think it is your Stator period.

[macojoe]

Thanks again!!

There is a wire in the red plug that rotted out, BS found it and it does go to the tan wires!! So you might be right on the money!!

BS is coming Friday with a new wire harness for the motor, I am going to replace the boat side wire harness tomorrow cause I have one here.

Hopefully this will take care of the problem?? It has to be something simple like a wire cause everything was perfect till the sifter broke. and we disturbed wires.

[tsubaki]

Just remembered.
Usually you can crank an engine without the harness to the shifter connected and run but not be able to shut it off.
This may help localise the problem.
Start the engine, then unplug the harness under the cowling and see if the problem still exists. In order to shut it off, you must plug it back up in order to use the key switch as the kill or off position.
Unless the wire you are describing is in that harness connection.

[macojoe]

Are you saying the Red Plug?? That won't kill the motor after you unplug and should run fine??

[tsubaki]

Yes the red round one inside the cowl that goes to the control box and to the engine harness, about 1 1/2" round.
We have checked motors prior to purchase if controls were not available, say on the back of the boat or in a drum without the control box attached by jumping the starter solonoid and manually choking the engine. Only problem, there is no way to kill the engine except to choke it down or unplug the gas and let it run out.
Anyway...
This might let you localize it to the control box wires or the engine harness wires or not without replacing them.
I can't imagine it being either based on the way the VRO was wired but I have no experience on this.
Won't cost nothing but a trip to the ramp, at least you can experience how easy it is to steal a boat without a key.

[tsubaki]

You no be tried any ob dat today?

[macojoe]

Well I gave up as this motor has many issues and they keep coming the more we dig!!

So as of Friday I will be the new owner of a Mercury 2.4 175hp. Should be all installed and running by Friday night if the gods are with us!!

BS, CB, and I will bang it out in no time!! :sun:

Any one need OMC parts??

[phatdaddy]

MJ with a merc!!!!!!

Welcome to the dark side

[macojoe]

Yep I am coming to the Dark side, I was there once years ago, and as you have noticed I never went back!
But its a great deal and I have been promised I will not regret it!

So wish me luck!

[THEFERMANATOR]

Bummer dude. I personally wouldn't give up on the JOHNNY-RUDE myself. Unplug the black/yellow wires from the power packs, if it still happens then it isn't your harness. You will be able to run the engine, but to kill it you will have to flood it out with the primer. Your 86 has NO slow functions to it, it doesn't even have a fast idle. Another thing to note is your engine on that boat should be swinging a 15 or 17 pitch prop. I'm only slinging a 15 1/4 X 15 STILLETTO on my HYDRA with a 200 topping out at 43 @5500 RPM's. Slightly to large of a prop WILL keep a small bore engine from pulling up under load. Another quick thing to try is to push the key in for the primer when it won't go any faster, this will tell you if it is leaning out or not.

I wish you would have decided to get rid of this thing a few months back, I REALLY wanted a small bore 225 looper for my HYDRA. I still think your current engine is a MUCH better engine than the MERCURY for your application.

[macojoe]

Well now you show up!! Just kidding!

Well besides thge 2500 RPM thing, all the wires on the motor are soft and as we took the tape off them there were all kinds of breaks and green wires. Also some one had lots of conections spiced in. So the wires had to get done!!

The shift assembly were the shift intrup is also wore so bad that it would not shift right any longer and I had to have it welded. And reverse still isn't all that great.

The water pump is peeing real slow and there is water coming out the front of the mid section near were the steering arm bolts. Its a pretty bad leak, so bad that I think water must be getting to the drive shaft and rusted it in to the motor, as we can't get the lower unit off!
I mean we jumped, kicked. wedged, pryed, hit with a hammer that thing is on there solid!!

The compression has always been perfect in the 90's all 6 cyl. And when it was running this whole summr it ran great!! I guess what I should have done was to take and got the spare motor going, but that had a bad lower unit and bad eletric also.

So with all the things going on with the motor I have decided that the best thing to do is move on to another motor. The Merc just happened to show up at the right time for the right price.
And belive me after buying the house and all the toys I got for the boat over the winter I don't have a spare penny around here!! I had too beg borrow and steal to get this merc!

So wish me luck on the Dark Side!

Therm, no more vacations during the fishing seasons, you might have perveted me from going to the dark side! Its all your and skools fault for not being there for me!:hide:

[tsubaki]

MJ, being that thing is leaking water in those locations, it more than likely has corroded the spline locations at the lower bearing of the crankshaft and the shaft to the foot. It was probably caused (by the last owner) from improper alignment of the waterpump tube or it has rotted a hole in it.
I've fooled with one motor that was sunk for a period of time and it was a real SOB to remove.
The wedges and bumping of the propeller engauged over a period of days finally released it.
Sorry you went black.

[nipper]

Man, MJ, is this not the third engine you are now on in less than a year? I hope this one works out well for you.

[bigshrimpin]

MJ - If you don't like it . . . I'll buy it back from you :)

This was my dad's boat for 15 years . . . 25ft steigercraft with a 2.4L 200hp. 10.5 gph @3800 with a 15 pitch prop. It would top out at 5800rpm loaded. On a flat calm day it would just touch 40mph. The motor was still running strong when he repowered in 2001.

http://www.wellcraftv20.com/gallery/albums/album07/Reel.jpg

[macojoe]

This was the first motor I ran on this boat.

But the Wellcraft went Thur a few

165 I/O, raw water cooled, rotted from the inside out
175 Yamaha, Oil injection failed
2nd 150 Yamaha was junk when I got it,
175 Evinrude that I sold with it.

I really need to buy NEW but just can't swing the cash, and what a shame to spend $15,000+ for are short season!

I am sure I will be fine this time around, I can feel it! BS gong to take care of me!!

[chumbucket]

Sell the boat now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Get out while you can!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:cen:

[macojoe]

should have told me that 15 years ago!!! :bat:

[nymack66]

You are so close to fix the Rude ..I have a v6 lower unit if you need it fix the darn engine it will last ..Good luck with the new engine , fix this Rude for spare , so when Ferm is on the road again you use the spare until he's back !
As for going to the "dark" side now you can compare !!

[bigshrimpin]

[QUOTE=nymack66;125442]You are so close to fix the Rude ../QUOTE]

NYMack - You should see that motor . . . The motor is on it's 10th life. The only way that it'll survive is with a donor mid and lower and all new ignition and harness . . . and it's a BIG "if" whether the lower will drop. It's a total rehab . . . I wish it weren't. MJ is getting the motor with controls and prop mounted and rigged for $600 + the piles of aluminum scrap ;)

[macojoe]

Yep time to move on!! Is the Merc the way to go?? But we are going to find out fast!

It makes a ton of seance on my part! BS gets all the parts that I will ever need, he knows everything there is to know about them, and is willing to help when I need it!
I getting a great deal, and I have BS & CB as friends and fishing partners when ever they want to go!

What else could a guy want??

well thses guys are cute but a couple of super models would top off the deal! :love:

[nymack66]

Thanks,
I now see it as a blessing in disguise, knowing the facts ..

[randlemanboater]

I'm glad someone on here is getting that sweet motor BS has......I bet you will like the Merc MJ.

Ever since I saw those extra clean Merc/Mariners that BS is getting in, I have been looking for a cheep speed boat hull to put one of them on (please don't mention this to my wife).

[macojoe]

Well we finely got the bugs worked out of the Mercury!!

When we took for its first run it would bog down bad when trying to give it gas and BS said the Stator was gone.

When we got back to the house we ck the carbs and found a hole ton of crap in one! So BS had another set of carbs we cleaned all out and made sure all was well. Then tried again, but forgot to ck and clean fuel pump and when out there it ran better but the pump was failing.
So back to the house and got a kit and rebuilt the fuel pump.

Back to the water, again ran 100 times better but yet again something was still wrong, BS says like he had been the hole time the Stator, so back to the barn again we go.
This time BS comes with a pile of stuff everything we woukd need to rebuild the motor! He did a Stator test according to the book and the Stator was indeed bad!, Then ck the switch boxes and they were fine, the rectumfire (LOL) also had a hole burned thru it and we replaced that.
Then pulled all the wires 4 broke as we did this, and ck all the coils. replaced the wires and off to the water again!!

Well after 3 days and replacing most of the ignation system the motor ran like a champ!! We went out for a good hour of running and not a hicup!

It is the smallest horse power I would want on there, but it performs well. I might try a different prop but its not bad right now, my tac is not the best and we are not sure it right but its close.

So thanks to BS I am back on the water as of today!! Thanks BS!! :sun:

[THEFERMANATOR]

Get a MIRAGE PLUS or MICHIGAN WHEEL APOLLO large diameter prop. The extra large diameter will help out with the smaller HP on that big tank. You'll lose a little top end, but your mid range and slow speed control will be MUCH better.

[macojoe]

Yes it has a 15 X 17 right now, But I have a Hustler 15 1/2 x 15 here that just needs the merc hub, $35, I am going to give it a shot see what happens, and get another Tac. I agree a bigger proop is going to do the trick!!

If the Tac was right?? It was running 25 Kt at about 4500 to 4800 RPM Tacking wot at 5200 at 30 kts

[steplift20]

heres a stupid suggestion do you have the right prop size? to big and it wont go fast

[spareparts]

if its too much pitch, it wont allow the engine to rev to a higher rpm where it makes more power, you can step down in pitch and make more speed if the engine wasn't turning enough rpm