Engine Woes

[whale]

Well, I went out flukin' yesterday and today and ran into an engine problem. Being a relative newbie to owning a boat I am not well versed in outboard diagnosis. Thought I'd get some ideas first before I decide if I need to bring it to a pro.

On the way out yesterday , the motor (Johnson 115 hp) was running fine for about 5 miles. All of a sudden it started bogging down a bit and eventually it was in a sort of permanent bog down. It would run but the tach was up and down. Every once in a while it would catch and start to rev and run OK for a few seconds. Well, I was almost where I wanted to be so we limped there and drifted for fluke. Then, when I went to reposition, it ran fine every time after that. It ran fine all the way home (10 miles) also.

Along the way I had disconnected one of the 2 fuel filters I had inline and thought that the 2 filters was too much and restricting fuel flow. So, I thought everything was fine and headed out again today.

Well, same story, different day. Ran fine for a while then bogged down. After drifting for a while, it ran every time after that and all the way back to the slip.

So, it seems like a fuel flow issue but then it will run fine after sitting for a while. Any chance it is just spark plugs? I realized I didn't change them before this season. Any other ideas? The boat is in a slip so I didn't have a chance to try anything yet. It is also tough to troubleshoot due to the intermittent nature of the issue.

Please help!!

[THEFERMANATOR]

Have you removed the filters and checked them for water yet? Water can cause what you describe in there as water is to large of a molecule to pass through the element. Check your filters first. Also, was your primer bulb sucking together when this was happening?

[whale]

The racor filter has the clear bowl and there is no water in it. The boat has a new fuel tank this season so the gas is all pretty fresh (unless it came from the pump with water). The primer bulb looked normal. I found it peculiar that it ran fine both days on the way home after drifting with the motor not running for a while.

[Stillrunning]

I would still drain the sep. to see what you get.

[Blue_Runner]

Was the primer bulb nice and firm during the issue? Have a buddy squeeze the bulb while the problem is occurring to see if it clears it up.

Its entirely possible that the primer bulb ITSELF could be the problem. Check it real good for signs of dry rot (like cracks).

[whale]

When I changed the fuel tank in the offseason, I installed all new lines and a new primer bulb. Unless the bulb is faulty.....

[whale]

The first few times out this season I noticed a very slight hesitation a couple of times but it only lasted an instance and then it was fine so I blew it off.

[macojoe]

I had the same problem with my old Evinrude, it was the Ball and I had to get 3 before I got a good one, then it started again and one of the power packs let go.

But go with replacing the filter, they get clogged easy with this new gas cleaning the tank and the Racor being 10 mm.
Make sure the vent is clear.

were the hose that you replaced for the new gas??

[whale]

Yes, ethanol rated fuel lines.

Is the primer ball absolutely needed? Can I run without it for testing? I never have to use it anyway. I will reroute back to my old filter and put on a new one since I have a bunch of them and try that.

Could fouled plugs cause this?

[willy]

primer ball will cause all you are experiencing Kev, when it does it next check and see if it is collapsed on itself at all indicating a vacum situation, in other words clogged or plugged up on tank side of it or is it soft and easy to squeze indicating that it is letting air in somewhere. On my new boat went through three of them to get a good one and after that all has been fine.
you do need a primer bulb as there are times when you can lose your prime.
you also should have a in line filter under the hood of the engine, I think where the line goes into the carbs. check it for the same reason.
I do not believe plugs would cause your problem, but have you pulled them and checked their condition, as in dry wet oily and sooted up one diffrent than the other three?
My next step after checking those things would be to run her on an auxilliary five gallon boat fuel tank. If you have no problems you know it is from engine back on fuel system, if you still have it you can still have a fuel delivery problem with the fuel pump needing a rebuild kit cheap and fairly easy to do your self or a clogged carb jet or sticking fuel bowl float.
If those things come up clean then you are into taking it to a tech who can diagnose the electrical system for a timing power pack coil problem.
On my merc it did something like this as the power pack started crapping out and then would not run at all.
I don't think you have a timing type problem though as it would run crappy most of the time if not all of it. Also do not discount the idea of the tank being dirty as they can come new with crap in them and get dirty during install or have a clogged or defective pick up in them.
I am afraid like me you are going to have to slueth this one out. But if it get to that point run it in and have a pro look at it before your season flys by. It is a low hour engine and a very good one so it is going to be something pretty basic I would think.

[randlemanboater]

Whale, I'd find the SOB that sold you that heap and let him have it!

[willy]

:oh:Man talk about throwing a brother under the bus, and making him feel worse than he already feels

[whale]

:oh:Man talk about throwing a brother under the bus, and making him feel worse than he already feels

Nothing to feel bad about! If they ran perfectly all the time we'd have nothing to b itch about!

[whale]

Willy.....just and update in response to your inquiry on my other post. I have been away on vacation and motor has been untouched. On Wednesday I went by and checked a few things. I noticed the primer bulb all sucked in but after sitting 2 weeks that might be normal?? Anyway, I put on a new one. I also checked the vent line and it seemed OK. I checked the inline fuel filter that is on the motor and cleaned it. It is basically a conical screen that filters out particles where the fuel line enters the motor. There were a few bits in there but nothing that would obstruct fule flow. I took her out for a short run and it ran fine for about 20 minutes but it is tough to know as the problem had cropped up both times after running for a while.

[willy]

Sounds like you are taking the right approach, good luck
When you run next and if you do experience the problem again go right to that fuel bulb and see what it is doing, squeeze it and see what it feels like.
If it feels like a strippers silicon boob you are good there, if it feels like a Sister Gilda tuck in the belt boob you know you got the problem with the bulb or a vacum type leak in the line

[randlemanboater]

:oh:Man talk about throwing a brother under the bus, and making him feel worse than he already feels


Sorry, I couldn't resist.

Whale, the bulb shouldn't ever be sucked flat, sounds like it is either the bulb or the one way valve on top of the tank.....either one will be an easy fix.

[Carl]

I have no idea what the problem is, but I do like Willy's description !!!


If it feels like a strippers silicon boob you are good there ...


Carl

[willy]

I've been told I have a gift Carl, not sure what Ozzie meant but that is what he said.

[whale]

Ran fine today......went to the beach, then tubing, then fishing (fluke). I was running with the new primer bulb and just the Racor filter. The old filter I removed and took home the whole unit because I could not get the filter canister off.

Managed a couple keepers and just finished some deep fried deliciousness (fish, chips, onion rings). Can't beat fried fish only a couple hours after it was filleted!!

And, yes, Willy, you do have a gift. I will never forget the answering machine story...

http://wellcraftv20.com/community/showthread.php?t=2677&highlight=answering+machine

[willy]

Take care and comb your hair

[THEFERMANATOR]

Sounds like you are taking the right approach, good luck
When you run next and if you do experience the problem again go right to that fuel bulb and see what it is doing, squeeze it and see what it feels like.
If it feels like a strippers silicon boob you are good there, if it feels like a Sister Gilda tuck in the belt boob you know you got the problem with the bulb or a vacum type leak in the line

Maybe that's my problem, I aint never felt one of them there silicone boobs. I've always been preffered ole natural myself.

[willy]

You ain't missed much my friend, best au natural:beer:

[whale]

Well, after going over the fuel lines, filters, bulbs, vent etc everything had run fine for a couple of trips but then yesterday I had the problem again. Engine starts and runs fine for about 15-20 minutes at cruising speed then bogged down and got worse and worse. We limped to the fishing grounds and drifted a while. After that it ran fine again on the short repositioning moves between drifts and ran fine all the way home. I am starting to think it may be an electrical issue????

[Mulv80]

I would rebuild the carbs, probably some junk floating around in the bowls. You probably have some junk in your carbs from the old tank. That 115 is easy to work on and rebuilding carbs is a easy as pie. I had the issue with my Dad's Evinrude 120 and my Johnson 150. When you have junk in the carb the motor will run great until a piece of crud keeps the float needle from seating or a piece clogs your high speed jet then it will bogg down till it clears. Sometimes the debris will float around in there and the problem only occurs intermitently.

[Blue_Runner]

What Mulv said....my recent problem was trash in the carbs. Like you I saw just a few little bits of stuff in the filter on the motor. Didn't look like much to me but I know now that it was enough to wreak havoc on the carbs.

[whale]

OK, after long last I have an update. Due to vacations and company etc I did not have much opportunity to use the boat in August.

Well, a few weeks back I had bought carb kits and took my trailer down to the marina to pull the boat and take it home to work on it. Well, a buddy of mine suggested I talk to the old guy who lives next to the marina. He used to own it and he was a Johnson mechanic for many years. So, he introduced me and we talked a bit and he said "let's go for a ride". Well, my intermittent problem of bogging and lunging was happening most times out to the point that I had stopped trying. I took him (Charlie) for a ride and as soon as we hit deep water and tried to plane out it started surging etc. Right away he said it was not the carbs. His initial instinct was ignition. We went back and forth a few times and pulled the cowel. He messed with a few things and in the end thought (without any electrical testing) that it was likely the power pack. Well, I thought the gut instinct of a 75 year old Johnson mechanic was probably good. I bought a power pack and installed it myself with the boat in the water last week. I test ran for 45 minutes with no issues. Today we went fishing and ran for 2-3 hours and again no problems. Fingers crossed it seems like the power pack was the culprit. Back in business with time to spare before blackfish season!

[willy]

tough to beat those tough old birds, good call Kev:clap:

[reelapeelin]

tough to beat those tough old birds, good call Kev:clap:

Way to go whale...all the power pack probs I had sounded same, but never up and down...all down...glad ya got to the bottom and glad to learn power pack can be on/off issue...

...and Willy...this business about yer GIFT...Here's to ya Pal!!...a true gift it is:beer:

[randlemanboater]

Glad it is fix Whale.....you can't beat an old crusty mechanic......or boobs (real or fake).