need advice on used outboard purchase...

[bsteckel]

i am starting to look around for an outboard motor for my 1985 20' fisherman originally with a sea drive that has expired. i have a ton of experience with cars, but not much with boat motors, especially outboard motors. i have already found a flotation type bracket, so that is done.

from my research on this site, i am looking for a minimum of 150 hp to a max 0f 200 hp.

if i find a great deal on a 225, like the johnson motor posted in the classified section out of craigslist ... is it possible it can be used?

do i need to get all the steering, shift and throttle linkage or will the stuff i have work ... are all motors hydraulic steering and trim/tilt? what parts of the items i have in the boat can be re used if any?

what shoud i look for when looking at used outboards .. i see a lot about compression readings, etc. what are definite items i should be on the look out for.

i would like a dependable motor that i can work on myself rather than something i have to take to the dealer if there is a problem. i do not have enough experience to have develope a brand loyalty at this point. it looks like motors in the 1990 range - to mid nineties are available for a reasonable price. seen some yamahas, johnson, etc. i have read good things about the yamaha motors (2 stroke).

can you give me a crash course on what i need and what i should look for to do this project?

i know it is a tall order, but there is a lot of knowledge on this site!!!

thanks

Brad

[tsubaki]

Not having any prior knowledge about outboards, safest thing would be to buy a boat in running condition , use as many parts as possible and then sell or give away the unneeded hull.
Lots of times this is actually cheaper.

[spareparts]

check compresion, check for spark, check the lower unit for metal in the gear lube. Stay away from motors that have been used in salt water if you can help it. Loop charged motors are prefered(stay away from older John Rudes). Be carefull of the weight(some Yamaha 2 stroke engines are heavier than you think). Stick with a carb motor, you don't need the complexity of efi or dfi. Run away from anything that has Ficht written on it. Be carefull of "rebuilt" engines, theres no telling whats been done. Check Craigs list around areas with large lakes, between last years drought, and this years high gas prices, you may be able to find a deal on a whole boat, pull the motor, than sell or trade teh boat off.

Its a salt water motor, but look for something like this
http://www.charlestonfishing.com/forum/classDetail.asp?id=5321

[macojoe]

Everything spare said!!

Also 0n before 94 Yamaha had steel shift shafts that break and anything that old now that hasn't been fixed will soon! I have heard from $300 to as much as $1000 to replace them if needed!

Todays gas, I would stay 150 to 175 hp, most of the time they are the same motor just carb'ed different to get the extra HP.

[Bygracealone]

I converted my V20 from a Sea Drive to a bracket w/ outboard. I believe if you get a Johnson or Evinrude your controls will work; otherwise, you will need new controls. By controls, I'm referring to the control box and throttle and shifter cable. Wiring is a different matter. I think you might be okay if you get a Johnson or Evinrude older than 95 or older. Otherwise, you will need a new harness.

Not all motors come with hydraulic steering, so look carefully if you want it. If you want to keep the steering you currently have, you will probably have to make a few adjustments to the hoses to make them connect to a steering cylinder. If your next motor doesn't come with the cylinder, you will need to find one if you want to keep the hydraulic steering. I ended up ditching mine and going with a No Feedback Steering kit. I like it.

[THEFERMANATOR]

For a V-20 my first choice would coincide BIGSHRIMPIN's, and that would be a 2.0L MERCURY 150HP. They were light weight at around 385 pounds, made EXCELLENT RELIABLE power, fairly easy to work, and probably the best on fuel economy of any of the old school 2 strokers. The 2.4L and 2.5L MERCS are still reliable and TORQUE out of this world, but they are also THIRSTY! YAMAHA makes a good outboard as well with the exception of the steel shift shaft. There are also alot of parts avaiable for them as they are pretty reliable and don't need many. I'm personally not a big YAMAHA fan as they never impressed me power wise in the ones I seen. I really like the SUZUKI, but in the size range your looking I would avoid them as all of ther V-6's weigh in from 450-470 pounds. And if you wanna go with a JOHNNY-RUDE, my reccomendation would actually be a 140 from 85-94. They don't have the low RPM grunt of a V6, but once they hit there power band hang on. There also pretty good on fuel and very reliable. Downfall being weight as they weigh in close to 400 pounds. If you want a V-6 JOHNNY-RUDE, I would go early looper in a 200/225 configuration. They actually use about the same amount of fuel at cruise as the 150/175's did. They weigh in in the mid to upper 400 pound range though, and I would avoid them for the same reason as the SUZUKI.

These would be my choices and why I would consider each, and I would also seriously consider the weight issue as it says you have a fisherman model which should be a center console. The center consoles don't make the bracket conversion as easily as the cuddy did due to center of blance in the hull.

[willy]

Ferm, you are a pretty smart fellow


But I would disagree on only one point, Yamaha, I think that in the end even though they are a lower compression engine and do not put out the low end grunt of the Mercs they put out more than enough for just about any use short of around the pylon racing. What little they lose power wise they make up for many times over in outright reliability.
Now if I had your mechanical skills I would run mercs all day as I could fix just about anything that comes down the pike, but for an average joe blow like me the reliability and trouble free service far outweigh the slightly lower torque value.
As a second choice I would run JohnnyRude carbs and take the fuel hit for the longevity and durability factor.
The dozen or so friends of mine that have been very active boaters and very serious fisherman all their lives, men whose opinions I respect have had every motor there is, a few of them work on them themselves as they are skilled mechanics like you, but to a man they agree with the above statement. And to a man they have told me that for shear power it is tough to beat a Merc but have your wallet handy.

[THEFERMANATOR]

The 2.4L MERCS can get costly when something let's go in em, but the 2L's aren't as bad. They use a standard steel sleeve so they are not as expensive to rebuild, and electronics on them can be found easily and fit a wide range of years. YAMAHA's never really apealed to me as I remember being a kid and our 25HP SUZUKI flat out dusting a guy in a smaller boat with a 50HP YAMAHA. Not to mention all of the boats with YAMAHA's I rode in didn't seem to impress me with there grunt. They are solid, and 150/175's and quite a few of the 200's had good reputations for reliability and fuel economy.

[bsteckel]

excellent info, guys ... a few more questions ..

ferm .. when you say "early" what years are referring to?

i have been looking at a 1990 johnson 225 ... states less than 100 hr on rebuilt power head .. controls and harness included $1000

and also a 1992 yamaha 200 ... stated 200-300 hrs freshwater use no controls $1600

i was told my boat (85 fisherman 20) may only hold a 200 hp motor ..my boat capacity decal is gone

would the extra 25 hp of the johnson be a problem with a bracket?

would either be easier to install with my current old setup (sea drive) than the other?

both of these are near where i live .. the yamaha is real close.

what do ya think?

[spareparts]

around here, the Yamahas are the most popular, thay have the percieved reputation of being more reliable. They generally cost more outright, usually packaged on more upscale boats, and are usually owned by people with more money and less mechanical ability. These people are more likely to have the shop do whatever it takes to make them run right and generally don't argue over price. They are serviced by the book with no skimping.( there are a lot of parraells here that can be referenced to certain brands of cars as well). The fact that these motors are generally serviced better has a lot to do with their reputation. I take nothing away form Yamaha, they build a very good engine. Depending on the hp and application, they usually rank either #1 or #2 in my choice of outboard power with Mercury. But they are not as good as a lot of people think they are, they break just like every other motor out there. Everyone tells me that Yamaha ignitions never give any trouble, you don't know how much time I've wasted diagnosing a rough running engine by ignoring ignition issues by believing they don't give any trouble. Ignitions are expensive!!!! for Yamahas, with virtualy no aftermarket replacement parts. Yamaha engines don't hold up to salt as well as Merc/John Rudes either. The paint they put on them holds up well, its where you cant see that they corrode(like most Japanese outboards). When we tear down a Yamaha lower unit, we allways get the torch out no matter how clean it looks. teh up side is that Yamaha complete new lower units cost about half as much as Mercurys. Every engine has its plus or minuses, consider the application, how its maintained, availabilty of parts and service, reputation, and resale when considering your purchase. Pay a professional thast familiar with that type of engine to check it out for you, its money well spent. If a good deal came up on a Yamaha, i wouldn't hesitate in buying one. Right now, I've got my eye on a 3.0L 225 carb Mercury that may end up on my V

[spareparts]

bstekel, I have seen some people replace their seadrive engines, reusing the bracket part of the seadrive. I don't know which ones will swap(Skools is the Johnrude guy around here), but if the seadrive bracket part of your motor is in good working order(trim system, steering system, etc), it could save you some money on repower. I had a picture of a latemodel "Eagle" series Johnrude in place of an older seadrive powerplant, but I can't seem to find it. If there is anything questionable about the seadrive bracket part, skip the idea, as there is very little available for parts for them

[bsteckel]

what do you think about goin to a 225 ... price is right, but i was told that my max on my boat may be 200?????

[randlemanboater]

The two Mercury outboards I have owned were trouble free, the best, most reliable 2 stroke motors I've ever had.......

The two OMC outboards I owned cost me $200 to fix every trip......

The Johnzuki I have now is even better than the Mercs, no oil to mess with......

:beer:

[willy]

Bsteckle, this is just from my personal experience, if you have a bracket or are doing a bracket do not put the bigger motors on that boat. They will not sit right in the water, they will not give you any appreciable gain in performance. Brackets all ready provide you with a noticeable gain in performance.
Every V I rode in with a bracket and a heavy motor on the back sat to low in the water in the arse, that is dangerous, that is wet as the scuppers will be below the waterline or so close they might as well be. With a couple of guys and other weight in the boat it will get worse.
The other problem with that is you will be dunking your engine if you come off of plane to quick, or if you fish in anything resembling where I fish in inlets around points etc.
Find a 115 to 150 light weight two stroke, put it on her and it will fly with that bracket, it will ride real nice to with no porpoising and you will not be hearing any gurgling from your engine on the end of every wave set or big boat wake.
Your boat without the heavier cuddy up front will be especially prone to these issues.
Trust me the extra little top end you pick up is no where worth the danger and aggravation you will get with a heavy motor on the back end

[bsteckel]

all good info .. thanks

i am making a deal on a flotation type bracket to hopefully help with some of those issues..

but avoiding extra weight would be a plus ..

[THEFERMANATOR]

The issue of weight that WILLY mentioned was my reason for reccomending the 2.0L MERCURY as my #1 pick. They're fairly light for a V-6 and PLENTY of power. I'm not sure on the YAMAHA's weight, but I believe it to be in the low 400's and the JOHNNY-RUDE will be in the mid to upper 400's. The 200 and 225 weighed the same from 86 on up, so there isn't much difference between the two. WEIGHT is your enemy here though, you gotta keep the weight down. I know others here have center consoles with brackets and they all have problems with sitting stern low in the water. The LIGHT V-4 would actually be best for this app, but not greatest for top end. And this is why the 2.0L MERC was my number 1 pick, it is actually lighter than my 140 V-4.

[randlemanboater]

Yeah, do a search for FLBuilder.....he redid a beautiful center console but had problems with it porposing because of the bracket.

I know I have seen several people on here moving gas tanks to the bow and relocating batteries trying to fix the problem on center consoles with brackets.

On the other hand, the cuddys seem to convert over just fine.

Spare has a great idea, hanging another motor onto the seadrive unit. I've seen them like that before also.

[bsteckel]

ok. ... now what years can i find a 2.0 mercury 150 ? are any years better than others?

[THEFERMANATOR]

1978 to around 2000. I would look for one from the late 80's that has the trim pump built in. The early ones use a remote mount pump for the trim and tilt. Nothing wrong with em, just prefer to have the leaner install of the later models. And the later models also came stock with the 40 amp charging system on them from around 88 on.

[THEFERMANATOR]

This one here would be high up on my reccomended list for your application. A 150 would probably be better, but the 135 is the same basic engine. This will give you an idea though of what to look for.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1994-MERCURY-135-HP-25-CARBURETED-OUTBOARD_W0QQitemZ180246054791QQihZ008QQcategoryZ1 11125QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[willy]

Can you guys imagie how much easier life would have been for all of us if we had the computer and a site like this years ago when we were younger and were able to bounce stuff off a bunch of other fellows who had been there seen that and done it.
I was thinking about that this morning

As ususal Ferm is on the mark with the engine info, sounds like that older Merc would be a great candidate
Good luck with your search

[bsteckel]

can't thank you enough for all of the info ... as willy says .. this site is great. you have a way better chance of getting it right the first time... when i was younger with no family .. i could make those mistakes and it was not a big deal..

now with a wife and kids, i can't afford to spend un wisely .. also get tired of hearing about it :)

if anyone comes across a nice 2l 150 merc in the northeast area .. philly, nj, ny .. let me know .. i would be grateful.

Brad

[THEFERMANATOR]

Another thing to keep in mind is to get a bracket with the least amount of set-back as you can get away with as possible. I would think a 26" set-back would still allow you to trim the engine up and to help keep the center of balance further forward.

[bsteckel]

found a 87 merc 150 exlpto ... is this a 2.0 l that i am looking for?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/_Boat-Parts-Accessories-Gear__1987-Mercury-Outboard-Used-150EXLPTO_W0QQitemZ180245681009QQadnZBoatQ20PartsQ 2cQ20AccessoriesQ20Q26Q20GearQQadiZ2823QQcmdZViewI tem?hash=item180245681009&

it is right were i am this weekend and would like to go look at it if it is the correct engine.

thanks

[THEFERMANATOR]

found a 87 merc 150 exlpto ... is this a 2.0 l that i am looking for?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/_Boat-Parts-Accessories-Gear__1987-Mercury-Outboard-Used-150EXLPTO_W0QQitemZ180245681009QQadnZBoatQ20PartsQ 2cQ20AccessoriesQ20Q26Q20GearQQadiZ2823QQcmdZViewI tem?hash=item180245681009&

it is right were i am this weekend and would like to go look at it if it is the correct engine.

thanks


I wouldn't buy that onbe if it were for me. The first thing I didn't like about it was that the airbox for trhe carbs is missing. This is an almost sure sign of an engine that somebody has tried to up the HP on and re-jet, or if it hasn't been re-jetted it's beggin to get burned up. And secondly it only has a 16 amp charging system on it. And lastly the compression numbers don't look good on it. The general rule is 10% difference from highest to lowest, that engine has one at 110 and another at 135. that is more than 10% and an almost definate sign of an engine trhat has been re-sleeved and over bored on one or two cylinders. It also looks to be a 2.4L to me, but I'm not that good at identifying them from pictures. I use the airbox to tell the difference and this one doesn't have an airbox.

[cterrebonne]

that should be a 2.0L. with those comp#'s i would pull the heads and inspect the cyl walls even before i thought about buying it. still 700 bucks if you know how to tool with merc i would buy it and put 700 bucks into for new internals and you basically have a very reliable engine.

[THEFERMANATOR]

I looked in the SIERRA MARINE catalog and it says it's an 86 150 according to the serial number, and it should be a 2.0L. Those compression numbers and the missing airbox are dead giveaways that somebody has been monkeying with the engine. It would make a ggod engine, but definately looks as though it will need work soon. I'll keep an eye out when I'm surfin to see if I can locate you a decent 2.0L outboard or at least a 2.0L powerhead. the 2.0L engines are pretty tough, and if left stock will run a long time. I have an 81 that needs new electronics, but other than that it is a solid engine that has never been rebuilt. The hard part is finding one in a 25" shaft as most of them were 20" shafts for bass boats.

[bsteckel]

i was thinking about driving over and looking at it ... it is at a local marina. what price is a deal that i cannot walk away from? not sure what these motors go for .. also not sure how easy they are to find .. lookd like it is missing prop and does not say if controls are with the motor.

i am afraid that the 200 hp fresh water yamaha (1992) i was looking at may be too heavy?

[willy]

Ferm, was my two 90's 150 Black Maxs the type you are talking about, because they were the engines that constantly needed attention, mostly electronic and or power pacs and crushed me for years ?

[THEFERMANATOR]

In the 90's it could have been 2.0L's or 2.5L's. They offered both in 150HP from around 91+. The switch boxes can give some trouble, but aren't normally that bad. No worse than OMC's powerpacks. All of them pretty well used the same electronics though if they were carb motors. Normally when they give constant problems with the electronics like you describe, there is a problem somewhere else that is actually causing the problem. Many times a stator will fail constantly from a bad rectifier or battery, but thet stator will get replaced and the other actual problem overlooked and then it happens again and again. Or switch boxes fail from the wrong stator flywheel combo or a bad coil, yet the switchbox is continually blamed when it is actually working fine but getting burned out by another problem.

As for what this engine is worth, I wouldn't go to high on it. These engines do pop-up from time to time with better options on them for fair money. I believe RM sold a nice one last year for $3400 on Ebay that was a 2.0L 150 25" shaft.

[bsteckel]

is there much of a weight savings from this merc we are speaking of to the 1992 200hp yamaha that i was thinking of looking at?

what kind of $$ are we talking to upgrade the charging system on this motor?

what should the compression numbers be ideally on this motor (merc) ?

as always, thanks for the info .. it is priceless.

[willy]

Think hard before doing a motor bigger than a 150 if you are doing a bracket. Don't rely on the flotation that comes with the bracket to make it work, it won't. It will mostly help offset the weight being extended 25-32 inches further back and will barely do that.

[THEFERMANATOR]

The MAJOR point to keep in mind here with a bracket conversion is running on plane. A flotation bracket will offset the balance when idling or off plane, but once your on plane that 350-400 pounds is hanging out there with nothing offsetting the balance. Trim tabs on a CC with a bracket should be mandatory I believe from what I have read on them. Unfortunately some of the lightest engine options are also some of the thirstiest. There are lighter outboards than the MERC 2.0L, but they guzzle fuel. The 92 200HP YAMAHA you are looking at should actually be the 2.6L(I think) YAMAHA which is the same basic engine from a 150-200. That was back in the day when YAMAHA got sued by OMC for patent infringement when they directly copied OMC's engines and sold them as YAMAHA's. The first YAMAHA V4 could almost interchange internal parts with an OMC V4, and many racers run the YAMAHA electronics on there OMC's as they are almost a match for each other.

The 92 200HP YAMAHA is 390 pounds according to ther NADA guide, so it would only be a couple pounds heavier than the MERC. It actually weighs the same as my 85 140 JOHNNY-RUDE I have, so it shouldn't be a major issue with weight on it.

I reccomend you read this thread as WHATKNOT just did a similiar conversion with a 150 YAMAHA(same weight as the 200 your eyeing).

http://www.wellcraftv20.com/community/showthread.php?t=9006

[bsteckel]

thanks for the info .. went to the marina and looked at the merc .. looks ok, was told that none of these engines have an air filter?? just an airbox which they say this one has. they ran it and it has a miss, also can hear it run on the ebay ad. stated they do not know what the miss is from .. could be as simple as a tune up or carb cleaning .. but to diagnose it, would be shop charge at $98 per hour. they have the motor for sale listed at $1800 but told me to make an offer of $1500 and that would probably take it. ebay auction is still at $710 with 3 days to go. maybe i will roll the dice and see what the auction brings.

As for the yamaha, the major flaw from what i can find out is the shift rod .. was told you can see if it is broken from the outside of the motor, but to fix it you have to take the power head off. upwards of a $1000 bill. how can i make sure this used yamaha i am eyeing up does not have shift rod problems?

keeping fingers crossed one of these motors will work out ,, if not.. the search continues.

Brad

[spareparts]

yeah none of the outboards have aircleaners(except Opti's), offer them $1000 cash, pending a compresion test, spark test, and check the gear lube. If they don't have anythign to hide, they should take it

[THEFERMANATOR]

yeah none of the outboards have aircleaners(except Opti's), offer them $1000 cash, pending a compresion test, spark test, and check the gear lube. If they don't have anythign to hide, they should take it

They list the compression numbers in there ad, and they didn't look good to me. low side 110 and high side 135. They don't have air filters, but the air box is an important item to leave on them if they are jetted stock. They resatrict the airflow just slightly t o control the metering circuits in the carbs, and if you remove it on a stock engine it will cause it to lean out and burn a piston and cause a miss or lock-up. I wouldn't offer him a $1000 for an engine with compression numbers like he posted it has, let alone if it has a miss.

On the YAMAHA all of em prior to 94 had a steel shift shaft and they are known to rot in two and then you can't shift them. The repair can range from around $250 for the shift rod and base gasket on up depending upon what else you have to do at the time of the repair. If the bolts that hold the powerhead on are seized in then the repair can get expensive and labor intensive.

[Geekie1]

If the 92 200 Yamaha was used in fresh water only, the shift rod has probably not corroded and it's not ready to break . It doesn't take alot of saltwater use to cause corrosion fast however. The 150, 175, and 200 Yamaha's are close to the same weight.

As far as reliability of early Yamaha V6's is concerned, they are about as simple and reliable as they get. The oil system is very simple and reliable. With the exception of the shift rod replacement, or power head removal (broken bolts) they are easy to work on. Rebuilding the water pump is very easy and I have been doing this repair for years. (about a 1.5 hr job)

I have had and still have Evinrude outboards and like them very much. However, I never owned an Evinrude or Johnson bigger than a three cylinder 70HP.

All in all, the Yamaha's I have owned have been the most reliable outboards by far. They are not the most fuel efficient, or fast, and they require regular preventive maintenance. But when I head out of the inlet to the open ocean, I am glad I have the Yamaha hung on my V's transom.

Geek

[Seaducer]

Brad, I know a guy who has a '91 jonny on his V20 Fisherman and says it does about 60mph. That's a little fast to me but a midrange RPM V-6 that old will get the same mileage as a 4cly. of the same year at top end. I just sold a boat that was slighly underpowered and I regretted that decision. If you don't mind a little more gas consumption get a low HP V-6, they just perform better. It is true that Yamahas are a bit more reliable, but Mercs have much more power and they use a great V-6 system of Optis. You sound like a faster kind of guy, and there is no problem considering EFIs. Like the Merc 2.5L's.

[macojoe]

Like to see that??

[Seaducer]

Like to see what?

[bradford]

A 60 mph V20.

[THEFERMANATOR]

A 60 mph V20.

Little out there, but you oughta be about as close to it as any of us. Unless CTT buys my 315HP MERCRUISER and drops it in his:clap:.

[bradford]

If I ever break down and buy a GPS I might find out.

[THEFERMANATOR]

If I ever break down and buy a GPS I might find out.

If you were closer I would loan ya one of mine, or better yet pace you in my FLATS boat. Had it up to 59 a couple weeks back with a 1/4 tank of fuel and 2 people on board. Although my girlfriend pretty well said she wouldn't let me go that fast again in a boat with her in it. Got her attention when she seen the speed and I launched off a wake of another boat:you:.

[bsteckel]

that merc auction is ending today in 1 hr .. price is up to $830 with 7 bids. hmmm... compression worries me though on that one cylinder.

[randlemanboater]

There are THOUSANDS of outboard motors out there, no need in buying one that worries you.

[Seaducer]

A 60 mph V20.
Yeah Brad; he says it does close to 60. He's got a 225 jonny on his 20 fisherman. Do you have any idea what yours can do?

[willy]

:bsflag:I think he is full of chips

[overboard]

I'll let you all know if a V20 with a 225 Evinrude will do 60 real soon. Right after I move, rent out my old house, fix the transom on the boat, and get it all rigged.... O.K. maybe not too soon, This list is depressing me.

[bsteckel]

that 150 merc went for 1236.00 .. too much with that miss and those compression numbers ..

search is still on.

my boat right now will do nowhere near 60 .... actually it will not even do 15 :) bought it with a blown sea drive.

60 would be nice .. i am a bit of a speed demon, at least on the ground .. but 40 on the water seems fast to me.

if the guy with the yamaha 200 replies back to me, may go look at that one.

looks like batteries to front is a good idea no matter what. or i can sit my fat @$$ up there and let the wife drive ...

on second thought .. skip that .. bad idea.

[THEFERMANATOR]

I think you made the reight choice on that MERC, and if you get the YAMAHA I think it would be a good choice. Just remember to keep it light. Unfortunately the lightest option is also the thirstiest option. An old 235 JOHNNY-RUDE would be light and powerful, but it earned it's reputation as the 2 thirsty 5 for a good reason.

[kamikaze]

Therm is right.

I can tell you from experince my 235's was thristy! 27 gph at WOT. My 74 CC ran 43 MPH with that motor just like every one else (sorry couldn't quite get 60!!!). The only outboard that I know that is thristier is what I'm running on my other boat!, a 250 V8 Johnson! 32 gph @ WOT - but it will push a old and heavy 25 Aquasport CC at 42 MPH.

Kamikaze

[tlb888]

Therm I will have to agree on the Yamaha. There are always so many people who say a 200 is too much and I will disagree everytime. I have a 1990 Yamaha 200 and in calm water I can do 47Kts or 56MPH WOT. That being said I rarely have to cruise anything above 3100 rpms for an economical cruise and still get to where I am going fairly quick. I have been on only one other V-20 and it had a 150 and that would be a bare minimum in my book.

[THEFERMANATOR]

Plus the YAMAHA 150 and 200 are the same weight in the early years as they are the same displacement. Mid to late 90's they upped the cubic inches of the 200 to the same as the 225/250's.

[bsteckel]

now i have another dilemma. i got a response from the guy selling that 1990 johnson 225. the ad states rebuilt powerhead with 100 hrs on it. 25" shaft .. controls and wire harness included.

this was the one that said "easy on gas" :) . asking price is $999

my boat is an 85 center console .. my max capacities decal is missing. someone posted that my boat is rated at 200 hp max.

i also read on here somewhere that this motor would fit my weight needs.

what are your thoughts .. i know some say it is too heavy, some say it is not. the other motor i was looking at is a 92 yamaha 200 with 300-400 hrs of freshwater use (?) power trim tilt/oil injected and no controls for $1600. the guy is hard to contact. does not seem real interested in selling it.

can i run a 225? is it much heavier than the 92 yammi 200 that you already gave me the green light?

thanks again

[willy]

There are fellows here that know these engines well and know if the weight would be a problem motor to motor.
Just being a amateur but seeing afew things in my day I would say do not exceed the horsepower rating. Do I think the manufacturer was being slightly conservative, possibly. Do I think the hull when NEW could handle it, yes.
If you are insuring the boat you will of course make it hard to collect for any damages you suffer. Could there be other legal problems, not likely but possible.
The major reason I would say to not do it is, it is unnessasary, you may be overpowering a old transom, you be be adding weight to an undesirable if not downright unsafe level.
The question in my mind at least is why?
JMHO

[bsteckel]

all good points .. i guess some of these boats were rated at 225 .. i think someone said that '85 was 200, but not sure.

i agree, if the max for my boat is indeed 200, then going beyond that may not be a good idea .. even for 25 hp.

i have no doubt the boat could handle it, especially if some years were rated for 225, not sure what changes could have been made to the hull for this ... maybe no changes were made.

i would be worried that if something happened, i would be sued by some lawyer stating that since i have 25 hp more, that is what caused the accident.

i am not sure what max hp my boat is rated at.

[THEFERMANATOR]

Up to 85 was 200HP max, and 86+ was 225HP max. The main reason for the increase in the max HP rating was the design of outboards changed. Up to 85 there wasn't a lightweight alternative to really get more than 200HP out of an outboard. In 86 OMC came out with the 200/225 loopers. The big V6 loopers from OMC weighed in close to 475-500 pounds, and that YAMAHA is just shy of 400. This is enough of a weight savings to make a difference on a bracket mount application. You can always try it and see how you like it, but I think WHATKNOT has a good balance on his with his YAMAHA he has. The extra HP isn't so much an issue as the extra weight that the big JOHNNY-RUDES pack. Look at it this way, MJ's SEA OX is a beast of a boat and he has a 225 EVINRUDE on it. Now consider the difference in balance and size, yet hanging that engine just as far back with just as much weight. That is a BIG difference in balance.

[bsteckel]

great info ...

did not know there was that much diff in weight between the yamaha and johnson .. that much weight would make a difference, especially with the bracket application.

all makes sense. thanks

[bsteckel]

on a side note....

where can i get a replacement max capacities plate for my boat? can you get them from wellcraft?

[bradford]

on a side note....

where can i get a replacement max capacities plate for my boat? can you get them from wellcraft?

Check the links section, you can get them on there. I'll trade ya my 225 Evinrude for Randleman's 140 Johnzuki, Deal?? LOL

[randlemanboater]

I'll trade ya my 225 Evinrude for Randleman's 140 Johnzuki, Deal?? LOL

Ahhhhh.......NO!

[randlemanboater]

Bsteckel, on another note, there are guys running 85 HP and 90 HP outboards on their V's here and they, while not "fast", are fuctional. So don't be worried about being underpowered with anything over that.

[willy]

for sure on that, ask Whale how Old School does with a 1999 115 hp johnson , it was plenty and then some. if I was going to be loaded up with a whole family and pulling adult skiers up out of the water regulary then a 150 would have been the ticket but the 115 did it. For fishing all day with a crew and coolers and all the paraphenalia that goes with it plus a full enclosure up she flew around 33=35 top end.
Cruise at around 23-35 was sweet and used very little gas.

[THEFERMANATOR]

The search may be over, found this one today for ya. I believe 2001 was the last year for the 2.0L 150's.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/CLEAN-2001-MERCURY-150-HP-SALTWATER-SERIES_W0QQitemZ230258340380QQihZ013QQcategoryZ504 39QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://i11.ebayimg.com/03/i/000/f4/b4/014b_12.JPG

[bsteckel]

wow .. that is a nice motor .. wonder if it is 25" shaft. a little more than i wanted to spend, i will definately keep my eye on it.

thanks!!!!!

[bsteckel]

if the guy ever calls me back that has the 200 hp yamaha (1992). but this motor has no controls. how much am i looking at for controls??? i assume mine will not work from the sea drive..

also stumbled on some new postings ...

1998 johnson 150 with controls 25" $1900

1988 merc blax max 175, 25", new water pump installed $1400/ bo

i reall like the 150 fermanator posted .. but looking at near $4000 with shipping ... would not have $$ left for the other plans i have :) but not out of the question yet.

also found this 2000 johnson 200 hp http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=001&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=110258351656&rd=1

[THEFERMANATOR]

if the guy ever calls me back that has the 200 hp yamaha (1992). but this motor has no controls. how much am i looking at for controls??? i assume mine will not work from the sea drive..

also stumbled on some new postings ...

1998 johnson 150 with controls 25" $1900

1988 merc blax max 175, 25", new water pump installed $1400/ bo

i reall like the 150 fermanator posted .. but looking at near $4000 with shipping ... would not have $$ left for the other plans i have :) but not out of the question yet.

also found this 2000 johnson 200 hp http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=001&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=110258351656&rd=1

Good engine but thirsty.

Excellent canidate, most likely a 2.0L in that year range.

A bit heavy, and thristy.

This one is right up there close to the big JOHNNY-RUDES in weight, but good on gas.

http://www.classicseacraft.com/forum/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=62697&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1

[kamikaze]

I have a 94 MERC 2.0L, 25" shaft with a older vertical reed powerhead recently installed listed on craigslist 2100.00 but will sell to a member for 1900.00. Here's the link if your interested.

http://fredericksburg.craigslist.org/boa/700244741.html

Kamikaze

[bsteckel]

that suzuki looks real nice .. but my boat can only handle 200 hp!!! arrgh.

what am i looking at for additional costs buying a motor with no controls?

kamikaze .. does your motor have controls? is the power head used? the motor looks real nice.

[macojoe]

Controls with wire harness if needed run like $500 new

[THEFERMANATOR]

that suzuki looks real nice .. but my boat can only handle 200 hp!!! arrgh.

what am i looking at for additional costs buying a motor with no controls?

kamikaze .. does your motor have controls? is the power head used? the motor looks real nice.

The extra 25HP wouldn't concern me as much as the 470 pounds of engine weight. That 225HP SUZUKI is easy on fuel, and good top end. There a bit lacking in the bottom end torque department because of there low 2.7L displacement though. I like that 150 that kamikaze has for sale, it would be IDEAL for your project.

[bsteckel]

thanks, ferm. i sent an email to the guy with the 88 black max to see if it is indeed a 2.0 motor.

kamikaze... your motor sounds good, not sure what the older style power head means .. good, bad, neither. shipping would be the next question. would you consider shipping this motor? what is missing from the motor (controls, prop, etc) that i would need to scrounge up?

it is better to buy new controls as macojoe says for $500? i guess old cables could be a problem???

[bsteckel]

called the guy with the black max 175 .. states it is the type with seperate tilt/trim pump,etc...

gave me the serial number 5320623 .. can you tell if this is a 2.0L ??

thanks

[kamikaze]

bsteckel:

Motor as a ignition harness but no controls for throttle and shift, or trim/tilt and there is no prop either. I'd be willing to ship it but would rather have you come and hear it run first. If your going to spend the money I don't suspect it's that far of a drive for you (then again I have gone to Miami to pick up a boat before so I have no problem with driving!)

Older powerhead is just that (80's) mounted on a 1994 engine As THERM said MERC made a ton of these engines. When I got the motor the powerhead had two bad cylinders (oil reservoir hose came off at the injector and it didn't take long after for the problem to set in after that! - thus why the oil injection system is now removed.)

Instead of rebuilding the original powerhead, I purchased a older used 135 HP 2.0L powerhead off of Screamandfly.com. Suspect powerhead was rebuilt at sometime as the welch plug isn't stamp with a model number and typically they are. I rebuilt the carbs from the original powerhead and reinstalled them on the replacement ,bring it back to a 150. Believe the stator and trigger have been recently replaced as well based on their appearance alone.

Kamikaze

[bsteckel]

i stumbled across a 1995 150 merc ... but it is a 2.5, not a 2.0

what are the pros/cons of the 2.5 vs 2.0?

comes with controls and stainless prop ... under 200 hrs asking price is $2000 .. compression is good at 125lbs in all holes. motor tested on ddt tester (not sure what that is) with no problems.

of course, this is what was told to me.

sounds like a good price

guy with the yamaha for sale seems to be very busy .. not sure why you would advertise something for sale and then never be available to sell it????

[THEFERMANATOR]

Since you say it was tested on a DDT, I'm assuming it's an EFI. If so it is one THIRSTY SOB, believe me I have one. They have torque that is out of this world though for a small V-6, but that 12-13 gallons per hour at cruise is a killer. Also a 25" shaft 2.5L EFI weighs in around 425 pounds. If I was considering a 2.5L, I would go with a 200HP for the reduced cruising RPM's. This will give you an idea of the fuel burn for a 2.5L 150, the older engines are close but slightly higher(about 5-8% more fuel burn).

http://www.mercurymarine.com/look_deeper/boat_house_bulletin.php?ID=196&SortBy=Title&Section=outboardChecks&hp5090150efi=20

[bsteckel]

how much more fuel does the 2.5 150 burn at cruise than the 2.0 150?

there must be some advantage for efi? less smoke? better response?

thanks

[THEFERMANATOR]

The EFI is easier to start, and runs a little smoother. Many say the carb motors are actually btter on fuel than the EFI, and they both use the same oil injection pump so oil consumption on oil injected models is the same. The EFI I have does have INCREDIBLE off idle performance compared to my 2.0L. I know my 2.5L 150 EFI burns 12-13 GPH on an 18' flats boat, I have a 2L 150 on a 17.6' bass boat that burns about 4-5 GPH at the same cruise speed and RPM's. The bass boat is lighter, but the 2.L is alot better IMO. The 2.0L will use a little more fuel at idle due to porting inside the engine, and the 2.5L has ALOT more torque.

[bsteckel]

wow, that is almost double the fuel consumption ... is there that much difference in weight between the 2 boats ?..

that 2.5 is 35 lbs heavier approx than the yamaha i am looking at .. and 40 lbs heavier than the 2.0 150 .. not a huge difference.but coming with controls and a ss prop, that is less things that i have to buy. unless the ss prop that came with my sea drive would fit, then the controls is the only difference.

but double the fuel consumption ... wow.

[THEFERMANATOR]

The bass boat weighs in at 800 pounds hull weight, my flats boat weighs in at 1400 pounds hull weight. They both run almost the same numbers at each RPM point, but the bass boat uses alot less fuel. It only has a 14 gallon tank in it, and I took it out one day for 2 1/2 hours and only burned 11 gallons running it the whole time on a river.

[bsteckel]

ok ... i just located a motor for sale about 8 miles from my house. it is a 1998 suzuki 200 hp 25" with stainless prop. the price is going to be real right.

not sure on the hours, etc .. would like to go take a look at it before i lose this one.

and also, the yamaha guy returned an email that maybe we can get together this week to look at his motor (1992 200hp).

what do you think about the suzuki? i have heard good things about them.

i also scored a stainless marine floatation bracket 26" setback.

things are starting to come together!!! :clap:

[THEFERMANATOR]

The SUZUKI will be back to a weight issue as all of the V-6 SUZUKI 2 strokes weigh in at 470+ pounds. Solid engine though, just make sure to check the lower unit for cracks in the exhaust area where the prop rides inside the lower. They have a problem with cracking through there, and are not repairable once it happens.

[bsteckel]

i thought i may be able to get away with the extra weight by getting a minimal set back bracket ..

i was reading builderfl's threads over the weekend .. do you know what motor he was running on his center console and the weight? the porpoising (sp?) issues seem hard to fix.

looked like a mercury 200, but not sure. it seems he was running quite a bit more set back than i will have. not sure how much difference this makes.

happy father's day to all the dads out there!!

[THEFERMANATOR]

BUILDERFL is running quite a bit of set back on his. IIRC he has a 30" setback with another 6 in his jack plate. I believe he has a 2.4L 200 MERC on the back, which is actually a few pounds lighter than a 2.0L 150 MERC(2.0L has steel sleeves, and the 2.4L's are aluminum coated with NICASIL or CHROME). The less set-back you go with the better. If that 200 SUZUKI checks out, it may not be a bad option. The SUZUKI's are supposed to be better on fuel at cruise compared to a MERC, but don't have the top end power of a MERC because of there lower RPM capability. I've been a SUZUKI fan for awhile as well, and wish I could have afforded that 225 and the fuel to go get it recently instead of rebuilding my 200 EVINRUDE.

[bsteckel]

well, just got back from looking at the suzuki .. a few problems .

the guy cut the wire harness .. not sure why .. and is not able to start or even turn the motor over. no idea of how many hours, compression readings ,etc.

also, there is a crack in the small fin (not sure what you call this piece) at the front of the motor .. is this cavatation plate???? it is the small one,not the biggest fin..

also a small piece missing from the skeg ...

biggest problem is even though the hood says 200 .. the model number is DT225 .. which is clearly not a 200 hp motor. i have the serial number, but not sure if it even is a 1998 or not.

does have ss prop, but he could not take it off for me to look for those cracks you were telling me about.

probably a wise decision to pass. i need to be patient here .. but that is not one of my strong qualities :)

[THEFERMANATOR]

The SUZUKI 150, 200, and 225 are all the same basic engine. Was this the engine on Ebay? How many spark plugs does it have? And what is the serial number? And also remember just because it has a prop with it(wether it be stainless or not), it doesn't neccesarily mean you can use it. Every boat has a different demand for what it needs in a prop as far as pitch, rake, cup and diameter.

[bsteckel]

yes it is on ebay ...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/_Boat-Parts-Accessories-Gear__1998-Suzuki-200hp-outboard-boat-motor-engine_W0QQitemZ250258991643QQadnZBoatQ20PartsQ2cQ 20AccessoriesQ20Q26Q20GearQQadiZ2823QQcmdZViewItem ?hash=item250258991643&

serial # is 22501-651203

other number is DT225 .. i assume this is model number

not sure on the number of spark plugs ..

[THEFERMANATOR]

serial # is 22501-651203

not sure on the number of spark plugs ..

That serial number is for a 96 225HP SUZUKI. The reason I ask how many spark plugs is a 200 EFI will have 1 per cylinder, 6 total. A 225 will always be an EFI with 2 plugs per cylinder, so 12 total. The 150 EFI SUPER SIX bass boat special will also have 12 spark plugs. The serial number on the clamp bracket may not be right though, as many change out the whole bracket for a used one when the trim and tilt gives any issues.

[bsteckel]

if i had to guess, i thought i saw only 6 spark plugs. i would have to ask him for sure.

[bsteckel]

got an email back from the seller .. has only 6 spark plugs ..

must be a 200 hp.

wonder if the other items i noticed are a concern.

[bsteckel]

check this out, ferm ... that merc 150 you found me on ebay a while back .. the one that was labeled "clean" .. the auction was ended all of a sudden .. it is now relisted

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/_Boat-Parts-Accessories-Gear__CLEAN-2001-MERCURY-150-HP-SALTWATER-SERIES_W0QQitemZ230262507201QQadnZBoatQ20PartsQ2cQ 20AccessoriesQ20Q26Q20GearQQadiZ2823QQcmdZViewItem ?hash=item230262507201&

it looks as though there is a compression problem on one cylinder ... 5 are at 125 and one is at 90.

what do you think?

[THEFERMANATOR]

It w ould be a good rebuilder probably, but not for $3K. Good engines are out there as people are moving up to direct injected engines and 4 strokers as the price of gas goes upward. If your not going to use it alot, then a 150/175 JOHNNY_RUDE would work out for ya.

[bigshrimpin]

I have 2 motors you might be interested in . . . 1988 2.4L Merc 175 and a 1992 2.5L 200 Mariner offshore. Both have good compression b/w 115 and 120psi in all 6 cylinders, Lower Units pressure tested, gear oil drained and checked shavings, oil injection is still installed. There going up onto ebay this week . . . $2000 for the Mariner 200 and $1600 for the 2.4L 175.
I'd could even do a delivery/install for $250 extra.

Let me know if you are interested.

[whatknot]

My dad is giving me (yes, giving me) a 2007 Yami 150 4 stroke and my 99 150 2 stroke is up for sale. The only thing wrong with it is a few minor paint chips on the cowling. It's on my v20 now. Runs great and serviced always. Have to check to see what it's worth. I'm sure I'll get a bunch of crap for that last statement...

http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z159/68cobrajet/IMG_0383.jpg

[bsteckel]

bigshrimpin and whatknot .. thanks for the info..

bigshrimpin .. i am in PA ... you are in CA? did i read that you would deliver and install the motor for me for $250????? :sun:

man, you guys are really great on this site .. i am almost glad i picked up this boat project.


Whatknot ... i have eyeing up your boat for some time .. exactly what i am doing. let me know what you are looking to get for your motor. take it easy on me .... i am already over budget :) maybe you can pass on the favor that your dad is doing for you to me .. :clap:



my email address is [email protected]

thanks again

Brad

[THEFERMANATOR]

BigShrimpin is back on the right coast again IIRC. Somewhere up in MA is what I remember reading.

[bigshrimpin]

bsteckel - whatknot's 99 Yamaha is a better motor for the v20 in terms of economy . . . not sure the price difference . . . but I'm back east with 14 motors I need to blow out and part out to make room for more. I'm installing a 20" Merc 175 on Thursday in Maine and I have both the motors mentioned ready to go. I have a few blocks that need to go to A1 outboards in PA and I think I could probably double up the trip. If you are interested . . . PM me and I'll send you my contact information.

[bsteckel]

sounds good ... do you have just those 2 motors in 25"??? wouldnt by chance have any 2.0 mercs????

thanks

Brad

[bigshrimpin]

I have 2 2.oL parts motor and I have one nice 96 2.0L powrhead that is still in CA. If you can wait a month or so . . . That one will be back here. I come across good deals all the time . . . so keep in touch.

[bsteckel]

bigshrimpin .. thanks for the offer .. i am in no hurry .. the boat is not seeing the water anytime soon as i have loads of other things to do.

let me know what you get in...

the search continues......

[bsteckel]

what hp did merc make with the 2.0? is it just 150hp or did they do 175 or 200 .. i see quite a few motors but almost none of them list whether it is a 2.0 or not.

i was on the phone with 1 outboard and they told me to stay away from 2.4 or 2.5 mercs as they have problems with the block .. not nearly as strong as the 2.0?????

i am looking at one on ebay .. motor cover says 2.5 but the ad reads that it has a 2.4 power head.????

bigshrimpin .. what is the weight of the merc motor you were telling me about ... is it near what a 2.0 250 would weigh? do you have any pics??

thanks

[bsteckel]

kamikaze .. did you sell that 2.0 you had for sale on craigslist?

[Stillrunning]

check this out, ferm ... that merc 150 you found me on ebay a while back .. the one that was labeled "clean" .. the auction was ended all of a sudden .. it is now relisted

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/_Boat-Parts-Accessories-Gear__CLEAN-2001-MERCURY-150-HP-SALTWATER-SERIES_W0QQitemZ230262507201QQadnZBoatQ20PartsQ2cQ 20AccessoriesQ20Q26Q20GearQQadiZ2823QQcmdZViewItem ?hash=item230262507201&

it looks as though there is a compression problem on one cylinder ... 5 are at 125 and one is at 90.

what do you think?

That motor has been cleaned up painted and looks almost new. People do this because it draws the attention away from the mecanics and to how clean it looks. I would rather see an engine that they have not detail and that way you can focus on what matters and not the fancy new paint job.

[THEFERMANATOR]

That motor has been cleaned up painted and looks almost new. People do this because it draws the attention away from the mecanics and to how clean it looks. I would rather see an engine that they have not detail and that way you can focus on what matters and not the fancy new paint job.

Now you know, my 150 on my flats boat I have for sale is that clean. And it's a 95. Them freshwater motors sure stay clean compared to a slaty dog.

[bsteckel]

ferm .. check my post 3 above your last post .. question about 2.0 motors ... thanks

[THEFERMANATOR]

2.0's came in 135/150/175. The 2.5L's aren't a bad engine by any means, steel sleeve motors most of em just like the 2.0's. The 2.5L engine actually has better porting and such in it. The 2.4L engines use a special sleeveing set-up cosisting of either NICASIL or CHROME depending upon year and model. Some of them have been re-sleeved with steel sleeves though as the NICASIL and CHROME is BIG money to repair. The 2.0L's are known for being stout engines, can't nobody take that from em either.

[bsteckel]

how bout a 94 merc 225 3.0l carbed motor .. looks like it weighs 395lbs. only 10 more than the 2.0 150..

how are these motors? ... weight is right.

[THEFERMANATOR]

how bout a 94 merc 225 3.0l carbed motor .. looks like it weighs 395lbs. only 10 more than the 2.0 150..

how are these motors? ... weight is right.

That weight sounds AWFULLY LOW for a 3.0L MERC. I want to say they are closer to 450-475 pounds(maybe even more). The 3.0L is a big engine compared to a 2.0L. And an AWFUL LOT OF TORQUE for a V-20. They were not bad on fuel, but did use ALOT of oil. Had one on a PRO-LINE 231 years back. Boat held 125 gallons of gas, and 3 gallons of oil. It would ALWAYS run out of oil before gas on a long trip. You had to carry extra oil with you on that boat, not to mention how much it ALWAYS smoked. The 3.0L's I want to say ran the oil injection at 75:1 at idle, and 32:1 at WOT, and dropped back to 40:1 for cruise.

[bigshrimpin]

That guy with who list the 175 with the external pump is a decade off on the date of that motor. serial number beginning with 532 for the 175 is 1978 not 1988. I like those motors, but there worth $500 on a good day . . . unless it's in mint condition.

[bsteckel]

shrimpin ... what does your 2.4 175 look like? what kind of shape is it in? and also the 2.0 you may be able to put together in a month ..

what kind of shape is that one in? ..

i am doing this boat over so i want something that looks presentable while also vg in mechanical condition.

ferm ... i got that weight from the nada online guide .. it lists the 225 at 395 lbs ...

the smoking problem worries me .. not interested in getting smoked out.

[bsteckel]

ok ... i found this .. guy has an 2002 evinrude 200 hp ficht .. powerhead blew and there is a hole in it .. supposedly in great condition other than that .. freshwater use.

i know this motor is a bit heavy ... someone in the beginning of my search said stay away from anything with ficht written on it? not sure why.

thinking of going this route and either getting a power head ready to go or finding and rebuilding one .. this way i know what i have.

any thoughts on this?

[macojoe]

powerhead blew and there is a hole in it .. supposedly in great condition other than that ..


:you::haha:

[THEFERMANATOR]

ok ... i found this .. guy has an 2002 evinrude 200 hp ficht .. powerhead blew and there is a hole in it .. supposedly in great condition other than that .. freshwater use.

i know this motor is a bit heavy ... someone in the beginning of my search said stay away from anything with ficht written on it? not sure why.

thinking of going this route and either getting a power head ready to go or finding and rebuilding one .. this way i know what i have.

any thoughts on this?

My question would be why did it blow? Powerheads don't normally just blow a hole through the block unless something else was wrong that caused it to happen. Engines do wear out, but not many actually wear them out. Look at it this way, you get a rebuilt powerhead for it or rebuild one. Don't kid yourself it WILL cost AT LEAST $2000 if you can do the whole job(with the exception of machineing) yourself. A rebuilt powerhead will set you back closer to $4K because a windowed block will most likely not be an acceptable core.

Then you still have an unknown engine with a MAJOR problem to be fixed still. I did a nice write-up awhile back about this, most overlook why the original failure occurred and then it happens again right away. So after say $2000-$2500 for the rebuild and a few incidentals, now your going to be takeing it to a FICHT expert for programming(or buying the software yourself) to set-it up for break-in. And now you have an engine that could still need an injector or EMM to fix the original failure. You could spend another $1K REAL quick paying a shop to diagnose an engine that VERY few understand and can work on.

FICHTS aren't all bad, but when you get a problem child ANYTHING it can cost you a FORTUNE to keep it running.

[bsteckel]

good point, ferm. i was tossing around the idea of buying a motor that i knew was broke then fixing it and knowing what i have ..

versus taking someone's word on a running engine and then rolling the dice on how long it lasts.

crap shoot either way.

did locate a 93 yammi 150 .. it is the c series that does not have oil injection .. may take a look this weekend.

[THEFERMANATOR]

good point, ferm. i was tossing around the idea of buying a motor that i knew was broke then fixing it and knowing what i have ..

versus taking someone's word on a running engine and then rolling the dice on how long it lasts.

crap shoot either way.

did locate a 93 yammi 150 .. it is the c series that does not have oil injection .. may take a look this weekend.


There's nothing wrong with getting a fixer, but I would limit that search to an engine that the average person can fix WITHOUT a laptop. A FICHT or OPTIMAX would not be my idea of an economical fixer upper. There's alot of MERCURY and OMC parts out there at pretty much any given time for reasonable money. MOST DFI engines are considered a throw away engine once any major problems occur. The replacement of an early OPTIMAX's compressor is almost not feasible considering a compressor will set you back for close to a $1K in parts on a $2-3K engine.

[bsteckel]

here we go again ... am on vacation for the next 10 days in DE ... located a 98 yamaha 150, oil inj. saltwater series motor. guy says he bought 2 motors as a pair .. approx 450 hours. installed this one on his boat. he could not get the motor to spin up past 3100 rpms or so .. took off carbs, cleaned them .. tried again .. no go. changed fuel pump ... again no go. i think he even replaced the carbs and still no high rpms.

so then he gave up and put the other motor on that he got and it worked great. so now this motor is for sale. says he checked compression and all were 98-115. he says that is all he can tell me. he gave up and put the other motor on .. then this one went in storage. did not have the time to fool with it.

motor looks real nice externally. not sure what else could be the problem. he said he can rev the motor up past 3100 by hand, but when motor is in gear .. no go.

does this sound like something i should walk from or maybe this could be an easy fix .. not sure what there is left to try.

thanks

[CaptJJ]

Looks like you decided the not to go for the evinrude, would have been my choice too. I think they had alot of problems early 2000's.
sorry I don't have any input for the 98 Yamaha, I will ask my buddy who is a outboard mechanic for you.

[THEFERMANATOR]

Sounds like a bad stator on the YAMAHA, or something with the timing advance.

[bsteckel]

ferm ... something i should run away from .. or simple (read affordable) fix? i see he just put it up on ebay.

[THEFERMANATOR]

Electrical on a YAMAHA can get REAL expensive, REAL quick. May be a cheap fix, but without some testing couldn't give you much idea of it's condition.

[bsteckel]

ok ... will scratch that one off the list .

thanks

[bigshrimpin]

I'll take a picture of the Cherry 2.4L 175 that I picked up . . . Not a spec of rust on the steering arm or anywhere else on the motor. Compression is perfect on this engine 125 - 130psi.

[bsteckel]

that would be great!!! send it when you can, i would appreciate it.

Brad

[whatknot]

Sorry it took so long to get back. I've hung the yamaha back on the 89 (ish) 20ft Mako.
Boat, motor and trailer (single axle) are for sale. Entire package is $6500. Boat itself needs a little love, but it's a solid hull. I would paint the deck. This has been a great inshore-nearshore fishing boat.

Bimini top, bow rail, (not mounted for shrimpin)

Motor runs strong and is clean. Absolutely nothing, I mean nothing wrong with this motor.
The only reason I'm selling it is I've upgraded to a 150 4 stroke courtesy of my Dad!
nada =$4200 on motor only.

Motor has Sea Star hydraulics on it. $300
Selling digital Guages with wiring. $350

Can't post any pics cause photophukit won't let me log in.
See gallery center console page 3 for motor only. Look for Whatknot...

[bigshrimpin]

Sorry - I've been busy here. The 1993 200 2.5L is gone, but I took in a pair of 1981 Merc 2.4L 225's and a set of 2000 150 2.5L Mercury EFI's are coming tomorrow. I'll get a picture of the 1986 175 up tonight. I might have another 175 shortly :)

[bsteckel]

big shrimpin .. thanks ..

i like the sound of the newer motors ... '86 is a little older than i would like .. pm me on what you have and what you are lookin to get for them, especially the 175 you have coming in and the '00 motors.

thanks and keep me posted ..

[bigshrimpin]

Here's the 1986 175 2.4L Mercury. They don't get any cleaner than this!!

Compression 125 - 130psi in all 6 cylinders.

http://www.wellcraftv20.com/gallery/albums/album162/DSCN0781_Medium.jpg
http://www.wellcraftv20.com/gallery/albums/album162/DSCN0786_Medium.jpg

[bigshrimpin]

1989 2.0L Mercury 135. It's a 20" motor, but I have a 25" mid that will swap. I can make it black or grey. Also a freshwater motor. Compression is 115psi in all 6.

http://www.wellcraftv20.com/gallery/albums/album162/DSCN0765_Medium.jpg
http://www.wellcraftv20.com/gallery/albums/album162/DSCN0766_Medium.jpg
http://www.wellcraftv20.com/gallery/albums/album162/DSCN0763_Medium.jpg

[bigshrimpin]

$1600 for the 2.4L 175 or $1800 for the 2.0L 135.

The 2000 150 EFI is rebuildable and I'm going to save that for myself.
The other one is sold already.

[THEFERMANATOR]

If it were for me, I would go with the 135. It appears to have the 40 amp charging, and you can't beat a 2.0L for reliability and durability.

[bigshrimpin]

Let me know ASAP. I'm putting them up on ebay tonight :)

[bsteckel]

a couple of things .. do you have pics of the hoods ?

which one is nicer cosmetically? want something that looks much newer than it is. i am very anal that way.

i am worried that the 135 will be too small for my boat. not sure what the perf difference will be from the 150-175 hp.

what comes with them as far as prop / and or controls. or do you have these items and how much additional ?

also, how would we work out delivery? will try to get back to you asap. . i am on vaca this week and not on the computer as much lately.

[bsteckel]

and basically the only diff between a 135 and a 150 2.0 motor is the carbs .. how hard is it to get back that hp?

[randlemanboater]

Man, you won't find anything better than those last two at twice the price.

[THEFERMANATOR]

and basically the only diff between a 135 and a 150 2.0 motor is the carbs .. how hard is it to get back that hp?

Find a saet of 150 carbs. The 135's are the same engine as the early 150's. When they went to rating them at the prop the 150 became a 135, and the 175 became a 150. So just find a set of late 80's 150 carbs or early 80's 175 carbs. I don't remember the exact WH number on em right now.

[bigshrimpin]

I have a set of 2.0L 150 carbs that I'll include with the deal if you want them . . . I'd recommend cleaning them first before bolting them on.

The exhaust tuner is different too. I can put a 2.4L 200hp tuner and that'll bump up the HP some.

************************************************** ******************
Personally I think you'd be happier with the 2.4L 175 . . . cause that's what I run on my boat.

[bsteckel]

shrimpin ... see my post from 9:13 am this morning .. a few other questions.

thanks

[bigshrimpin]

It sounds like you want a newer motor, so don't feel obligated . . . I'm just showing you what I have. I'll make a run back to the shop tomorrow and get some photos of the cowlings. The lid for the mariner has the decals removed it's sea ray motor. The Mercury 175 is the clamshell style and it's in great shape for it's age. Keep in mind the 175 can easily be converted to the newer bucket style cowling with the hard mounts. I have a decent 1998 135 Mercury cowling now. Controls are included (they are NOT new, but they work)

I can deliver for roughly $250 and hang either motor. What town are you in again?

I got an 1989 175 in yesterday, but it's not ready. Steering arm is very rusty.

[bsteckel]

how bout a ss prop?

pics would be great ... also pic of the newer style cowling.

i am in effort, pa .. pocono mountains .. about 8 miles south of the pocono raceway if you are a nascar fan.

i am no where near ready for motor to be mounted ..would meet you somewhere rather than have you come all the way here.

i just worry about a motor that is that old ... but you would know better than me what goes wrong with these motors ..

maybe technology is not that much different from a 1993 motor to a 1986 motor ??

[THEFERMANATOR]

maybe technology is not that much different from a 1993 motor to a 1986 motor ??

On the MERC's there isn't really much technology change from the early 80's to late 90's. Some of the newer engines actually had less desireable parts for some uses. The early engines in some instances actually had better performing parts, sometimes the other way though. Just because it's newer don't make it better. My 98 200HP EVINRUDE has an 89 powerhead because the original 98 block rotted out in the liners. It's a crap shoot with any engine, unfortunately you can't predict if or when they will go.

[randlemanboater]

Find a saet of 150 carbs. The 135's are the same engine as the early 150's. When they went to rating them at the prop the 150 became a 135, and the 175 became a 150. So just find a set of late 80's 150 carbs or early 80's 175 carbs. I don't remember the exact WH number on em right now.

BST may never find a motor to suit him, but this has been a very informative thread so far.

I always wondered why Merc would "detune" the 150 to make a 135, now I know "the rest of the story".

[Bygracealone]

tell you what, if I were in the market, I'd be taking you up on one of these BS...

You've got some CLEAN motors there...

BS, where you livin' now? Did you make your final transition back to the east coast?

[bigshrimpin]

I'm in Whitman, MA . . . almost next door to CB in Rockland (south shore area). I've been able to find some unusually clean freshwater motors, since I've come back here. The stuff in CA is all clean . . . the saltwater stuff is awful to tear down when I get a parts motor in trade. The 2000 150 EFI's looked brand new. I'm selling the block for the same price I paid for the blown motor :)

[bsteckel]

well, i sure do hope i find a motor to suit me....:) it seems like every one i find, has some issues that are uncovered.

i would like something that is not an antique, and does not look like an antique.

i guess there are not many guys out there that keep things in good shape. i have seen motors that i would not even think of hanging on my boat .. i dont care how good they say they run. unfortunately i have this hangup with appearance .. i need things to look as good as they perform.

BS ..your motors look nice and clean .. maybe i can get a newer hood to bring the looks back into the 90's and get close to the 200 hp i am looking for. that may fit the bill nicely.

shoot me some pics of what you have... also need a prop.

also stumbled on a '93 yammi 150 here in DEL while on vaca. guy is kinda high on price at this point, but that may change.

i agree with the fact that this thread has been informative. i know i have learned a lot and hopefully someone who is doing what i am doing in the future can benefit as well.

i wish i was not on such a budget .. i could have saved hours and just hung a new one on there ..but thats not gonna happen.

[bsteckel]

found something else when i was at the bait store today ..

150 yamaha ... but only a 20" shaft.

how hard and costly would it be to convert to a 25" motor? is a 1986 model year motor.

[bsteckel]

BS .. do either of your motors look like this one?

http://www.wellcraftv20.com/community/showthread.php?t=1125&

[bigshrimpin]

I have this 175 XRI cowling from my motor . . . from my 1979 V200.

http://www.wellcraftv20.com/gallery/albums/seacraft_part2/DSCN6661.jpg
http://www.wellcraftv20.com/gallery/albums/seacraft_part2/DSCN6992.jpg


If you like :)

[bsteckel]

yes .. that cowling is nice .. looks like the one i put the link to.

why don't you PM me a number so we can talk specifics ..

thanks.

[willy]

Bsteckle, got to tell ya, if I was shopping for a Merc I would be heading to Mass. as quick as my F250 would take me to get an engine from Tim.

[bsteckel]

will do willy ... hopefully we can work something out .. maybe he is a nascar fan and will be coming to Pocono for a race sometime soon :):sun:

my diesel is pretty thirsty and at $5+ per gal, i may have to take a loan for the trip :bat: .

[bsteckel]

BS ... called you today .. left you a voicemail message.

[bsteckel]

Hey Shrimpin ..

what happened to the 175 that went on ebay? no longer listed?

[bigshrimpin]

sale pending ;) I just took in a nice 80's Mariner 2.0L.
If you want a bargain . . . I'll let this one go for $1250.
I've got to go through it this week . . . and it's the first week of commercial bass,
so it might happen next week.

[bsteckel]

ok .. keep me posted ... call me or email ..

i can also give you my work number so that the call is free:clap:

and go catch some !!!!!!

Brad

[bigshrimpin]

Here's a few pics of another one :) It was a 20" so I didn't even mention it. I'll call you Monday.

http://www.wellcraftv20.com/gallery/albums/album167/DSCN0873_Medium.jpg
http://www.wellcraftv20.com/gallery/albums/album167/DSCN0870_Medium.jpg
http://www.wellcraftv20.com/gallery/albums/album167/DSCN0905_Medium.jpg

[shaneburris74]

I have read this entire thread and it has been very informing. I'm actually thinking about hanging my 150 merc on my V-20 cuddy now once it is ready to receive.
I was wanting to sell it and get a Yammie or a Johnnie Rud but reading all this makes me think I oughta just keep it and save my money. It broke 2 out of the first 3 times I had it out. BUT Since I've got the electonics lined out (swithboxes of course) it has given me no problems. It still has a stigma with me because I had to limp back a few miles on 3 cylinders. I still haven't forgiven it yet. It is steadily gaining back my trust though.

Can you tell me if I have one of the 2.0L's that you guys speak so highly of? Here is my motor info.

Motor is a 1993 150cxr standard carbed 150 25" Serial number is OD206574

[bigshrimpin]

well, i sure do hope i find a motor to suit me....:) it seems like every one i find, has some issues that are uncovered.



This is going to be true with every $1500 - $2500 motor. People wouldn't be selling them if there was nothing wrong with them. You just need to figure out if the problems are something you can fix or deal with. If you keep looking you'll find a gem. If you can wait until Nov/Dec . . . You can get some smokin deals. You just need to budget for it and not blow your wad until the holiday season.

The value I add (or at least am trying to add) to the buying equation is that I've done the leg work to locate exceptional older motors and fixed any issues with them. I will not sell POS motors or attempt to mask major problems . . . those motors get stripped of good parts and go to the scrap yard.

[randlemanboater]

Here's one that MIGHT be good enough.

http://charlotte.craigslist.org/boa/761110038.html

[bigshrimpin]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170241273229