V2o Steplift

[nymack66]

Help , I picked up this v20 steplift hull this weekend at a bargain to good to refuse, I have since clean and pressure wash it, I am getting quotes to have the bottom painted and the sides from the rub rail down , previous owner painted it with what seems like a roller brush then someone hose it off . The paint runs are quite visible and horrible.
First of all I must say the hull is in excellent condition very solid and the cuddy is immaculate.
Plan is to restore it and swap my engine over and sell my current hull.
The fiberglass from the rub rail up is excellent and I will like to just clean it up and keep the glass work on top.
I am at lost in regards to the sides; do I strip the paint off and just have it re-painted? If so what brand and kind of paint to use ?
I am leaning towards a Blue for the bottom white hi –gloss for the sides?
I need a cabin door and two rod boxes any ideas ?

[randlemanboater]

Congrats on the "new boat".

There is a current thread going about rod boxes, check it out.http://www.wellcraftv20.com/community/showthread.php?t=9432

I think BeaverDamMarine was scrapping a V recently, he might have a door.

[macojoe]

Before you get going, have you ck ed the transom ?? Make sure it is solid as all the decks! You don't want to go wild and find that you have to tear into something and waste all your time and money.

awlgrip paint is the only way to go if you are going to paint it!! On something like this time is your friend!! Don't rush it!!

CK out this thread, Skools has rebuilt a boat from ground zero lots of info here go thru the hole thing!!
There is another boat in there so don't get confused, but I will tell you will learn all you need right there!!

http://wellcraftv20.com/community/showthread.php?t=5978&highlight=micro

[msbhammer]

Welcome to the site man. : )

[nymack66]

Can I mount Evinrude 140 20" shaft on this hull , Its a 1984 v20 Steplift the transom seems to be higher than my 83 v20 Steplift by approximately three inches , Or can I use a Jack Plate , I have seen some pros mentioned "Jack Plates was not meant to compensate a short shaft motor"

[THEFERMANATOR]

Looking at that picture tells me you MOST likely will need a complete transom in that boat. You can see the silicone gooped up on some old transducer holes, and there appears to be some cracks over on the port side where the aluminum is missing. I' malmost willing to bet that boat was pulled out of service for a reason looking at that picture. And no, your 20" shaft won't directly swap over. You would either have to convert yours to a 25", or cut that one down like your 83 is. First thing you need to do is get that aluminum off and look in there and see what you find. But make sure and keep it covered over, many a transom has gone bad because people left that cover off.

[nymack66]

The Transom looks solid, I check the inside also looks good no cracks etc, I will patch and fix the holes you see on the back and the remove and re-seal under the cap, in regards to the height can a Jack plate resolve this it seems to be just 3 to 4 inches higher that the other Transom. Please let me know.

[THEFERMANATOR]

Make sure and check the areas circled in red VERY closely. The lower keft area appears to have screw holes that are open. The upper left in the picture appears to have cracks in it from the photo(weakining transoms often start to show up in this area first). And the lower right is more screw holes. As for a jack plate it could be used, but the problem will be you wouldn't be able to trim your engine up as the cowling would hit the transom. You either have to cut the 25" down to a 20", or make your 20" shaft a 25". WELLCRAFT offered the V-20 with either a 20" or 25" transom from the late 70's to the mid 80'd. Early on they were all pretty much 20" since that was a long shaft, and later on 25" was the standard.

[nymack66]

I have since started the careful process of stripping and sanding. Stripping the area that’s really bad and sanding the other areas.
This is what it looks like after sanding with a very course orbital sander.
Next week it will be sanded down again.
Any ideas what the “gray” looking stuff is its not paint for sure looks like the protection for the fiberglass.
I am open for ideas in regards to primer, type for the bottom and sides, number of coats etc.
I have no idea and kindly seeking ideas.
Thanks to all who post to this forum, your ideas and sharing your experiences are great and very helpful.

[randlemanboater]

As for a jack plate it could be used, but the problem will be you wouldn't be able to trim your engine up as the cowling would hit the transom.

Unless you get a hydraulic jackplate, then you could raise it up to tilt.....man, that would be cool.....expensive but cool.

[THEFERMANATOR]

Unless you get a hydraulic jackplate, then you could raise it up to tilt.....man, that would be cool.....expensive but cool.

Seems a bit pricey to as a used hydraulic jack plate will fetch $500 around these parts, new is right around $900-1000. But I do have to say that is a creative idea RM. I seen one guy use a 10" setback manul jack plate to put a 20 on a 25. It gave him enough room to trim it out for running, just couldn't trim it up and get it out of the water.

[nymack66]

Well following your suggestions I decided to mark and cut the transom down to fit my 20 inch motor.
Well I got more that I bargain for, Ferm did raise some questions after looking at the previous pictures I posted, he was correct the transom wood is completely soaked after cutting down the five inches as shown, the wood is all wet but not rotten the plywood separated from each other easily almost like they were not glued together (see pieces of wood separated).
Question is can I ignore it for at least another six months and pour a new one or I MUST address it now.
My thoughts is to bolt up my engine and run the summer lakes only and drive accordingly
Reason is I am about to move and is also strapped for cash.
Please advice, I will consider all ideas.

[THEFERMANATOR]

That looks like freshwater rot to me, so I wouldn't dare try and run it on plane. Once it begins to delaminate, it will break. Try the NIDACORE or ARJAY pourable and repair it that way and be done with it. If your other V-20 is useable, why not keep it until you can redo this one?

[nymack66]

You are so right Ferm, Thanks for the advice; I will slowly start to chain saw the old wood out and clean it up. Which one will you recommend base on the fact I am in Orlando and you familiar with the climatic conditions.
Arjay or Nadacore ?
Ferm do you think I should take this approach or the one on this site where a chain saw was used?
http://transomrepair.com/SkinRemoval
The one show on the hyper link seems to make the removal of the rotten wood easier ..
Please let me know , I will start tomorrow.

[THEFERMANATOR]

http://www.wellcraftv20.com/community/showthread.php?t=8830&highlight=transom

I'd follow this thread for the how to on it. And the ARJAY 6011 is made in SARASOTA I believe so the shipping should be pretty reasonaeable to ORLANDO. I believe NIDACORE is made in the MIAMI area, but is basically the same as the ARJAY from what I have been able to research on it.

[nymack66]

Ferm,
I jump the gun on this one. It seems like the wood is NOT rotten after all, it was soaked because I remove the cap and it rained like hell and soak the darn thing for tow days before I got to it this weekend, I attempted to chain saw it and instantly hit solid wood, Its still a little wet, I will let it dry for a couple days and make and assessment.
I have shown it to my friend and he thinks all is ok. I will let it dry and drill a couple test holes lower to analyze it better (holes for engine mount).
The chain saw removes some wood that appears to be good, still not sure, I will keep you posted, Thanks for your help again.

[THEFERMANATOR]

From looking at your pictures and what you describe, it looks like this hull suffers from the classic aluminum cap problem that so many V-20's suffer from. They get wet and begin to rot from the top down. Looks like you caught it in the early stages of it though. If you could dry it out, you could use some KWIK POLY to treat it and strengthen it back.

[nymack66]

I have since completed the sanding and preparation for painting, I also cut down the transom for my 20***8221; Evinrude, I will glass over the top of the expose wood on the transom and paint along with the rest of the pending paint work.
Problem is this, I need to paint the boat white both sides and bottom ( I will stripe it on the sides) and be able to use the same primer and paint on the sides and the bottom, I have no need for anti fouling paint since this boat is used on the weekends here in Florida more damage from above that below :)
I can***8217;t seem to find a primer and paint listed for the complete job in other words it seems like ***8220;Topside***8221; and ***8220;below the water line***8221; is what is presented to me.
Question is can I find and affordable solution to paint both sides and the bottom using the same primer and paint?
Or do I have to go Topside paint and primer and anti fouling blue below the water line?
Also is there a primer for anti fouling.
Please see pictures and give me some ideas. I really thought the sanding part was hard until I went to West Marine shopping for paint.

[bradford]

I'd talk to a couple people here that have painted their boats recently before a gave any of my hard earned cash over to the shylocks at west marine. A fellow with the screen name khied comes to mind with a chris craft scorpion.

[nymack66]

I have since decided to re build the transom after all, glad I did it was not rotted but soaked all the way down. I removed part of the skin for better and easier access to the wood removal since it’s not quite rotten it’s tough removing it new chain and all.
After I clean it up completely I will set the skin back in place and then pour it.
I will post pictures as I go along. I have the hull completely sanded and ready to prime I will be working on both at the same time hopefully I will have decent hull when completed.
Wish me luck..

[nymack66]

Removing the wood is quite a challenge even with the partial skin removal, The wood at the sides are sold, pain in the neck, I am moving up to rental saw 20" bar in the morning its going to get done.
Tip: If you ever pounce upon a hull to good to be true PASS :)
As for the material for the transom I am in a dilemma not sure which way to go just yet.
SeaCast have a distributor here in Florida, hour drive from where I live , Price is still 215 for 5 gallon.
Nida Core is still 119.00 (I can pick up also 2hr drive)
Arjay is 159.00 will drop ship for 20.00
Which one should I use? HEEEEEEEEEEELP !

[msbhammer]

Welcome to the site,great project going on, but you shouldnt have cut the outter skin off.
Cant pour in a new transom with the skin off.

[nymack66]

I am following this instruction, hopefully it works..
http://transomrepair.com/SkinRemoval/

[nymack66]

I will apply a few layers of woven mat with laminating resin to the inside walls of the transom with emphasis place to strengthen the skins and sealing all existing holes, I will not pour unless I felt its seal and strong. I will then re-attach the outer skin and glass it in before the big pour! I will post pictures as I work along.
Biggest let down so far was the darn chainsaw will not start I rented from Moon Belt Rentals.
My 16” chainsaw I brought from a pawn shop did the job.

[nymack66]

Moving along, Skin is back on as you can see, extra careful in securing it both with mat on the outside and in side. Re-coated the inside skin with resin. I can bet the farm the skin is on stronger than before.
I cut large pieces of fiberglass mat and soak it with resin and bonded it from the inside, four layers to be exact.
The stuff you see here is Fiberglass kitty hair and jelly as final coat.
http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/DSCF0044.jpg
http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/DSCF0045.jpg
http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/DSCF0046.jpg
http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/DSCF0047.jpg
Sanding it tonight and apply coat to imperfections and re sanding again then Gelcoat after the pour!

[macojoe]

Looks good so far! Good Luck with the pour!

[nymack66]

I am done pouring the Transom Arjay, its solid as a rock..I know it will outlast the Boat !
I not planning to install a cap, I hate it period. I will do some final sanding then paint primer.
http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/DSCF0019-1.jpg

[macojoe]

Looks great!! And there are a few here that took the alum caps off and just glassed and sanded to seal the transom. Much better way of doing it!

[CaptJJ]

Looks real nice, good work!:sun::beer:

[bradford]

Looks good, mine doesn't have a cap either, why drill extra holes in your transom for no reason.

[nymack66]

Thanks guys, your kind words goes a long way..!

[shaneburris74]

Looking great...I'm waiting on cooler weather here to tear in to mine...your giving me the confidence I need!
I'm very interested in your application of the gel-coat. It would be great to see alot of pics of that. I've heard you can brush it on as well as spray it. Seems like the brushing on would look like crap but I'm not familiar with gel-coat. Which are you doing?

[nymack66]

Thanks, Its easy make sure you seal EVERY HOLE, Arjay can be best describe as thick paint if it finds any hole it will spill out, That was my only little problem, also it does cure and heat up very hot so don’t panic. As for the Gel Coat I am still up for ideas, I am using the local guys for ideas, I may paint or gel not sure yet but I will let you know.

[reelapeelin]

Thanks, Its easy make sure you seal EVERY HOLE, Arjay can be best describe as thick paint if it finds any hole it will spill out, That was my only little problem, also it does cure and heat up very hot so don’t panic. As for the Gel Coat I am still up for ideas, I am using the local guys for ideas, I may paint or gel not sure yet but I will let you know.


GREAT JOB!!...looks good...one of these days on mine, and I'm gonna get rid of that ugly-*** cap, too...

[nymack66]

http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/Gel%20Coat%20First%20Coat/DSCF0004.jpg
http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/Gel%20Coat%20First%20Coat/DSCF0005.jpg
http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/Gel%20Coat%20First%20Coat/DSCF0008.jpg
http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/Gel%20Coat%20First%20Coat/DSCF0009.jpg
http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/Gel%20Coat%20First%20Coat/DSCF0011.jpg
http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/Gel%20Coat%20First%20Coat/DSCF0003.jpg
http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/Gel%20Coat%20First%20Coat/DSCF0011.jpg

[tsubaki]

Man, that looks goood!!
You can't stop to breath, now comes the fun parts!!

[THEFERMANATOR]

When do I bring mine over?

[reelapeelin]

Great Job!!...:clap:


one suggestion...those hatch lids on your stern have a bad habit of gettin' broken because they lay all the way over on the cleat as your picture shows...you might wanna consider a STOP chain inside of some kind to keep it from layin' all the way over like that...

[nymack66]

Great Job!!...:clap:


one suggestion...those hatch lids on your stern have a bad habit of gettin' broken because they lay all the way over on the cleat as your picture shows...you might wanna consider a STOP chain inside of some kind to keep it from layin' all the way over like that...

Thanks, I will install a stop chain ..Good tip .

[nymack66]

I made my plans, however when I went to work my plan I was forced to make changes.

I initially said I was going to roll and tip the gel not spray, this did not work out since the Home Depot sold me a roller, which came apart during the rolling.
I bit the bullet and brought a real gel coat gun with the correct nozzle 4.7 mm.
See link http://cgi.ebay.com/Gel-Coat-and-Resin-Spray-Gun-G100-6_W0QQitemZ250302445755QQihZ015QQcategoryZ26197QQs sPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
It goes back on ebay when I am done!

My progress so far with the Gel coating looks promising so I decided to do the entire Boat!
I have since remove the rails and patch all holes etc.
I pull the 60-gallon aluminum tank more holes that the government bailout plans.
Purchase a Poly tank used for 30 bucks, I will foam it in, its one inch too long for the hole on the deck, I will cut the deck floor and re-glass (I am confident I can re-attach it without any issues)

In the previous pictures hope you guys notice I eliminated the deck drains from both sides of the boat and re-routed both to the inside in the bilge area. I also lower the main drain hole in the transom to fully drain the hull!

Sanding, I refuse to go with the manual sanding block and that’s my line and I am sticking to it.

The orange peel effect from the previous extra thick spray (deliberately done to fill all minor flaws), I was forced to go with a 60 grit to cut the peel yes its that hard, and 220 to prep it for the final coat.
I am using the GelCoat as primer in this step if so to speak.


I am using a De-Fault palm sander and producing exceptional results, once this is done on the previous spray I will mist on a light coat of GelCoat and DURATEC HI-GLOSS CLEAR Mix 50/50 with gelcoat for a beautiful high-gloss finish.
I will post pictures of all the aforementioned steps

[cterrebonne]

nymack66 did you have to sand the gel after you sprayed with that cup gun? or did it put the gel down pretty smooth?

[kamikaze]

I'd be interested in some pics after the duratec mix is applied. Are you planning on using a smaller size tip for that coat?

Looks good!

Kamikaze

[nymack66]

I am still in the process of sanding the Orange peel off, I will be using the new Gun this weekend.
I found a few very little flaws if you will, I will be mixing Talc with some GelCoat (GelCoat Putty) to fill the voids (I am using this for the first time) From what I read so far this will make a very soft putty type filler out of GelCoat and is ideal for this stage in the finish.

In regards to the TIP been used I will be using the 4.7 MM as a test run this weekend.
This is the next TIP one size down 5/32" (3.9MM) Replacement nozzle for Model G100 and G200 spray cup guns.

[garagenc]

great looking

[nymack66]

I'd be interested in some pics after the duratec mix is applied. Are you planning on using a smaller size tip for that coat?

Looks good!

Kamikaze

I will post it ..
Note
After carefully reading the disclaimer for the Duratec and warnings I am happy to report it “known to cause Cancer in the state of California”
I am in Florida so I guess I safe

[kamikaze]

NYmack66:

Here's my 2 cents..

From what I have read you'll most likely need a much smaller tipped spray gun when using the gelcoat/duratec mix. My understanding (since I haven't it yet) is that when mixed 50/50, the Duratec significantly reduces the viscosity of the gelcoat to the point it can be sprayed from a HVLP using a 1.8MM or larger tip. I suspect a if you attempt to spray it form gun you used to apply the gelcoat (4.7 MM) you won't be happy with the results. If you need a gun for this phase of the project let me know and I'll send you the one I recently purchased (HVLP 2.3 MM) if you promise to return it when your finished.

P.S. Your going to need some of acetone to clean the gun after each use.


Kamikaze

[nymack66]

That is exactly what I was thinking in regards to the size of the tip on the GelCoat gun
Thanks for the offer but I do have a HVLP with a 1.8 or 2.0 mm tip.
Trust me I will Test Test before I do any major spraying.
I will be do some test runs this weekend on the console and the hatch with a small mixture, I let you know and post some pictures.

[shaneburris74]

NYMack,
How much of the transom compound did you use???? I know i've asked this before and I think MauryC said he used 15gal...or it could have been you that told me that.
I'm trying to set something up with the Nida-core guy right now so I need to nail down an amount. His price right now is $120 per 5 gal pail. I'm pretty happy with that.
Your V is looking outstanding. Its funny you mention that roller falling apart on you. I was watching an episode of Ship Shape TV a couple weeks ago and he made a point to mention not to use a standard foam brush for specific paints. Said it would fall apart...lol....guess thats true huh? But, Oh well..... if your're like me...if I don't learn it the hard way I don't learn it.

I was actually contemplating putting all my V refurbishment plans on hold until Obama took office. That way I'd have all the wealthy peoples money to spend on it. I don't think I can count on that though.

Yall be good..I'm out.

[nymack66]

I did use 15 gallons, I did spill about 2 gallons via a damm hole I never saw. Thats a very good price you are getting it for, As for the government sending us money the math is simple they will send you 40 you will have to return 100 ..

[nymack66]

Sanding the first coat of Gel Coat looks great but I am going to apply a final coat of Gel and Duratec after this is completed.

http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/Sanding%20Gelcoat/DSCF0024.jpg
http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/Sanding%20Gelcoat/DSCF0025.jpg
http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/Sanding%20Gelcoat/DSCF0026.jpg
Lots of sanding dust still on it, my bad I did not wipe it off before these pictures were taken

Remove the old aluminum tanks (not shown) lo and behold full of holes. This is the replacement tank
http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/Sanding%20Gelcoat/DSCF0028.jpg
Notice the cut in the deck? I will gel back in just like I did on the Transom when I remove the skin..

http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/Sanding%20Gelcoat/DSCF0029.jpg

http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/Sanding%20Gelcoat/DSCF0030.jpg

Replacing with a Tank I brought from Craigslist for thirty bucks of course it’s about two inches long, I cut a desk to insert it an will re-gel it back in.
I did notice the fuel feed is towards the bow, so I can only go ¼ tank of fuel if not I stall getting up on a plane?

[reelapeelin]

Why not turn the tank around so fill is in back?...

[nymack66]

Why not turn the tank around so fill is in back?...

Damm very good point, however I have since cut both new hoses to length, I guess I will have to eat the lost and buy new hoses..
I will go with your idea very good, thanks

[spareparts]

here's an idea, why not make a replacement pickup for the existing location that goes all the way to the back? Use aluminum tubing, remove the existing pickup, replace it with a new long one that goes to the back corner. Shouldn't be much difference than running a long piece of hose from teh pickup fwd before routing it back to the engine. Just a thought

[nymack66]

I like your idea 2, I guess I will do this since its cheaper ! Thanks guys !
Well thanks for the record lows in temp, I did no work on the Gel this weekend hopefully next weekend.

[nymack66]

Why not turn the tank around so fill is in back?...

I went with your idea , I also re-located the filler and vent to the back also

[nymack66]

NYmack66:

Here's my 2 cents..

From what I have read you'll most likely need a much smaller tipped spray gun when using the gelcoat/duratec mix. My understanding (since I haven't it yet) is that when mixed 50/50, the Duratec significantly reduces the viscosity of the gelcoat to the point it can be sprayed from a HVLP using a 1.8MM or larger tip. I suspect a if you attempt to spray it form gun you used to apply the gelcoat (4.7 MM) you won't be happy with the results. If you need a gun for this phase of the project let me know and I'll send you the one I recently purchased (HVLP 2.3 MM) if you promise to return it when your finished.

P.S. Your going to need some of acetone to clean the gun after each use.


Kamikaze
You were right, as for the Duratec it did add the mirror look to the gelcoat, I am very pleased with the results.
I will post some pictures this weekend.

[nymack66]

Pictures taken at night under the booth and the Gelcoat was still wet !

http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/gelcoat%20with%20imron/DSCF0114.jpg

http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/gelcoat%20with%20imron/DSCF0115.jpg

http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/gelcoat%20with%20imron/DSCF0130.jpg
Here is a fine example of gelcaot at its best, It takes time and many coats you can't rush this job for sure.

http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/gelcoat%20with%20imron/DSCF0131.jpg
Cuddy looks great !

http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc357/amackhrandilal/gelcoat%20with%20imron/DSCF0131.jpg