Trim Pump

[golver1]

Ok so this is a continuation from last year. Last year I had some problems with the boat and it turned out to be the Trim pump was gone.

Here is a little history:
81 Wellcraft V20 Straight 6 140hp with Mercruiser outdrive bought on ebay for $1000 in NJ last summer.

Boat has not been run yet. Mechanic was able to hand turn the motor and stated it look as good as it could, without running it.

Work done in last 8 months:
1. Removed both side panel gas tanks, inspected, cleaned, and reinstalled.
2. New fuel water seperator
3. New oil filter / oil change
4. New plugs
5. New anti-reverse switch
6. New Trim pump
7. Much new wiring
8. New fish finder
9. New radio
10. New radio antenia
11. New ignition switch
12. New Solenoids
13. Patched some "suspected" Hull dents and dings
14. Replaced entire wheel on trailer
15. New trailer lights
16. Replace all fuel lines
17. New bilge pump and wiring
18. New bilge blower and wiring
19. Clean nasty dirty bilge
20. Miscellanous parts (bilge cover, tie down, etc..)

Left to do:
1. Finish up some random wiring
2. Find frame for center windshield and side windshield.
3. Wash and wax hull (more for protection then looks)
4. Paint bottom (even though trailered)

Typed out it it doesn't seem as much work as it felt like trying to get it all done. LOL

So finally to my question. I replaced the trim pump, but it is wired slightly different then the one it replaced. Off the top of this one are 2 black wires that come off a bolt of a bracket that holds the solenoid on. I assume they are some sort of ground. Can someone tell me where they go? Is this where the ground to something else attaches or are these grounds for the pump, if they are grounds at all?

Also do I need to bleed the lines of air? If so how? Do they have a vent to work the air out itself? What do I refill the pump with, motor oil?
Thank you in advance.

[macojoe]

wires I have no idea?? Call the place were you got the motor from.

Use marine Hydraulic oil!! In a pinch I have used jack oil but you need the marine stuff!!

Bleeding. I ran all mine empty before and all I did was refill it. Then ran it a bunch of times and then refilled.


As for the motor, I would have done nothing till I heard that thing sing!!
Why have you not started it yet?? Thats alot of work just to find out that the thing is junk when the time comes!!

I did not see anything on your list for the lower unit?? Have you changed the lower unit oil?? New O rings on the fill and drain screw?? When was the last time the water pump was changed?
All things that need to be done and in working order before you launch!!

Nice to do all the paint and install eletronics bildge pumps ect ect....But it all means nothing unless she sings and pumps water!!

[golver1]

Why would I need to change the water pump? I don't know that it does not work yet. How do I test it to see if it is working?

We did changed the lower unit oil last year and will again this year before we finally start it. I will change the O rings when I change the oil this year.

I did not start the motor yet because I was told I couldn't. The outdrive is in the up position and I was told if I started the motor without lowering it, I would break a gimble or something. Thus I have spent my time trying to figure out the why the trim won't work.

Your kind of a negative person. I appreciate the help, but no need to give me a pounding with all the "!!" and the double ?? Congratulations on knowing more then me, which is why I came here to find a little help. That will be the last time I ask for help here.

Thanks

[macojoe]

I am the least negtive person here!! I have gone and done some things that no one should do!!

But I hate to see all this work done only for you to find out that the motor is junk when you start it!!

As for not starting the motor in the up position, What Nut case told you that??

so what you are telling me is that when you are using the motor in the water you will never beable to lift the engin to trim it cause somethig will break.
I had my I/O up and started and down and with no out drive attached at all!
Start it there will be no problem!!

As for the water pump, Just that you said it has sat around for awhile and you are doind all this work, Youdon't want the thing to start run and the pump be dead. It is a cheap easy fix and one less thing you have to worry aboout when you do get things going.

Ok I don't want you to cry that I am picking on you any more, just trying to help you!

Good Luck

[golver1]

I am crying :'(

Fix one thing, find another thing to fix. :'(

All I want to do is fish :'(

[golver1]

Ok, I bought a water pump. Will replace that tonite.

Last night I put the trim pump in with the following results:

1. I put the switch on the dash.
2. I ran the wiring harness to the back.
3. Plugged the red plug into the front of the pump.
4. The was a purple and blue wire with connectors on
them, I connected those to the connectors in my boat
that matched.
5. I left the black wires unattached (they appear to be a ground for something else??) and did not top
off the fluid yet though. There is fluid in it.
6. I connected the red wire to the "+" on the battery
and the black wire to the "-" on the battery.

Here is what it does. When I hit the bottom button on
the switch panel, the pump will make a sound like it
is working, but the out drive does not move at all.
The outdrive is currently in the up position.

The top and the middle button dont do anything at all.
No noise, no outdrive movement, nothing.

What have I done wrong? What else can I check?

[shicks007]

Golver,

Try and post these same questions on the iboats.com forums. They have been great help to me in the past. I think this is the right link, but you will have to register to post.

http://www.iboats.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum;f=24

Good Luck,
Scott

[golver1]

Thanks.

I just did that.

[golver1]

Ok, I got the trim pump working.

:-[ Just needed to push both buttons to get it to move up and needed some fluid ::)

Now the issue changes a little. Back to fix one thing, find another broken.

The lower unit does not go all the way down. At it's lowest point, the prop is still angled up. Shouldn't the lower unit lower to the point that the prop is parrallel to the ground?

Do I need to grease the rams or something?

[shicks007]

Golv,

I have an outboard so I'm not much help here. With that said, you might have to bleed the system of air some how. Just my 2 cents.

Good luck,
Scott

[golver1]

Thank you anyways ;)

I got all the air out, but the outdrive keeps stopping at about the same point every time. It just wont go down.

[Franco]

COULD IT BE OVERFILLED ? YOU CANT COMPRESS A FLUID AFTERALL. JUST A WORD OF ADVICE, IF YOU MAKE 1 FRIEND ON THIS FORUM, IT BETTER BE MACOJOE. HE IS KNOWN AND ADMIRED FOR CUTTING THRU ALL THE BULL**** AND DREAMS EVERYONE ELSE HAS. DAY FOR DAY I DOUGHT ANYONE HERE HAS MORE TIME ON THE WATER OR GETS MORE WORK DONE THAN MJ. HE MIGHT BE ABRUPT OR IN YOUR FACE SOMETIMES, BUT HE IS ABOUT THE BEST GUY TO HAVE IN YOUR CORNER!!!!!!!!

[golver1]

I have no problem with him or anyone else.

I was just very frustrated with my situation and was not in the mood for piling on at the time, I got a bit overwhelmed. I was trying to fix one thing, of which he gave no helpful advice, and then added 3 other things to worry about.

I meant nothing by it and am over it now. My bad. :-/

[Brian_M]

When I replaced the trim tilt on my I/O, the drive wouldn't go all the way down in the driveway, but in the water with the outdrive pushing the boatt did go all the way in. Not sure why, but I struggled with the same issue and it resolved itself on the first test run. It works in all ranges now, no problem

[macojoe]

Is the trim rod in the right hole??

There is a rod that goes threw the holes under the out drive. Take it out and move to the last hole.

Also like Franco says is it over filled??

[golver1]

Ok, I got it to go up and down last night. ;)

Where the arm goes in and out of the thicker part of the ram, there were what looked like some washers or C clips. One of them was stuck on the arm and would not let the arm compress into the thicker part of the ram, thus the outdrive could not lower.

I loosened it up with a screwdriver and it goes up and down perfectly.

Now I am worried about these clips/washers. The one that was stuck has now just been pushed to the end of the arm and is stuck down there. There are two others that are stuck down there too. They move freely, but can't get by the stuck one. What are these for? Can I replace them?

[macojoe]

Need a picture to be sure , But they are clips to help hold the motor up when trailing, to keep perssure off the tubes.

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10001&langId=-1&catalogId=10001&productId=151298


Or Maybe zinc, they put zinc on the tubes to stop them from rotting

[golver1]

I must be explaining it wrong. The link is not what they are. These are just 3 little washers that are sliding on the arm of the ram. One of them is open on one side like a c-clip retainer washer.

They slide down the arm of the ram and fit into the recessed end of the thicker part of the ram where the arm comes out of it.

[jaysea]

hi ,in my understanding.do you need to rebuilt the trim cylenders,on on i/o setup. because there become a build up of salt an it pushes the clips out.there are also a wiper,in ther that cleans off any debree from the main ram,if this helps,they sell a rebuilding seal kit that will help you solve any sticky piston problems,

[golver1]

The Trim is working; moving up and down now. It moves very very slow, but it is going up and down.

About 3-4 minutes from complete down to all the way up.

[reelapeelin]

3-4 mins sounds mighty slow...not sure what's missin' golver...is your new pump gettin' all the voltage it requires?...are there any grease fittings on the out-drive that need a shot?...is hydraulic fluid level where it should be?...rebuilding the rams as mentioned above might be needed...it's good you got it movin', but sounds like some more work to do...good luck w/it no matter what it takes... ;) ;D...

Could the hydraulic lines be partially clogged? ???...

[jaysea]

can you disconect the pistons from the outdrive, an lift the drive up an down with no problem.than try the pump an see if the pistons go in an out at the same time ,,then twist the pistons an check if there free other than that,you mite be air bound,good luck