JUST CAME IN...

[charlie_the_tuna]

well, just came in from outside. didnt go to far... about 3 miles to the nearest pile of subway cars. pretty good ground swell... about 4-6-8. dam thing NEEDS tabs. cant get the slice without them. all in all, not a horrible ride. better than some, not as good as others. seems like a well made little boat. not unpretty to look at. got a great deal. if she gives me another season or two i will be satisfied... BUT! im not sure i understand this cultlike following. sure, for the money you cant beat em and they are a dime a dozen. dam near everywhere you turn. but am i the only one willing to admit that the ride just aint that great? is it because i dont have tabs? must i spend another $600. bucks to get a decent ride? comments?
questions?
rebuttles?
insults?

[macojoe]

20 foot boat 4 to 8 foot seas??

What you want from a 20 footer??

[charlie_the_tuna]

MORE!!!

[bigshrimpin]

Good Luck!! No one is saying that this is the best ride in town. But it's a good ride and the fishing room is awesome for a 20ft'r. I've got a 20 seacraft now and the ride from my v20 steplift was better in some situations. If your boat is riding on it's side you're going to take a beating . . . I don't care what boat you're in. I think you need to get the boat level before you offer up an opinion.

[charlie_the_tuna]

hey bigshrimpin, i didnt really take a beating but i would have liked to have been able to trim out the ride. as for offering up my opinion on the way my boat rides, you had better believe that i will not hesitate to give my opinion, with or without tabs. this entire website is based on the free exchange of ideas and opinions, agreeable and otherwise, and i have just offered up one of mine. i dont always give the most popular opinion but i wont hesitate to offer it up. i got a great deal on my boat and i love it. plenty of things i would improve or change but all in all, conditions permitting, she will be a decent little inshore and offshore boat. MY BOAT!

[Mulv80]

I think you need to re-evaluate what your needs are. * If you want to fish big water than no 20 footer is going to fit the bill. *I think people read all the great feedback on this forum and think that the V-20 is more than it is. *I think for the most part the people on this forum love their V-20's for their versatility and their ability to adapt to almost any on water activity. *Granted there are boats that ride better, cruise better, and fish better, but few that can do them all as well as a V-20. *

[chumbucket]

Everything, and I mean everything in boat design is a tradeoff. I sincerely doubt there is one boat that anyone could say is perfect. With the V20 for example, I believe the center console offers up a better ride than the cuddy cabin model. Why? Because you're driving the boat from the center and further astern than with the cuddy cabin. Tradeoff? Sure, but I don't think I need to tell everyone that better ride, more fishing room, and all the other pluses are better than the dryness or convenience of their cuddy.
So, there are plenty of other tradeoffs when comparing the V20 to something more suitable for big water, such as comfort, safety, fuel economy and the list goes on and on.
The best you can hope for is to find something that does most things fairly well wrapped up in a fairly well constructed package and not too hard on the eye. Kind of like Mrs. Chumbucket. ;) ;D 8)

[sfprovyn]

I dont think its a cultlike following and a lot of guys on this board probably don't currently even own one.. whaler, Mako, SeaRays ,Gradys etc all have user groups including carolina skiffs. The v-20 in my opinion is not an off shore boat and neither is a 20 foot whaler or sea craft but thats just my opinion and I see them way out farther than they should be . I used to run a charter boat on the chesapeake bay in the mid 80's for a while and when the storms kicked up the small boats would suck in behind us as we came in and more than once I had to call in mayday's and pick guys out of the water.I was driving my friends Viking 57 last week in 5 footers and it was uncomfortable and guys were all falling on there *** trying to run rods etc. Even trimmed up with lots of horsepower the little V-20 is still a 20 foot boat. A great design and flare but 20 ft aint much in the big water if its sloppy..Inlets, near shore, bays and lakes is where she shines in my opinion. This is a great site and to celebrate I think I am going to have another glass of whiskey...Frank

[racerx]

well, if this isn't a cult, i dont know what i am going to do with all these dark robes and candles. i am glad we cleared this up. if i would have driven half way across the country for one of the rallies and didnt get to sacrifice a virgin...., man.

[Hammerhead]

A 30 foot Scarab with twin OBs should do the trick.

[TheTinMan]

I'm thinking (hoping) tabs will make a noticeable difference. I'm also not overly impressed with the ride without tabs. BUT, you have to remember this is a 20'6" boat.

I need a few things to get "right" on my boat before I can really make an accurate judgement call on the ride. First, as BS stated above, I need to get my boat level. Both batteries are on starboard side so I have starboard list. Second, I feel as if I don't have quite enough of "down trim", although it's real close. Tabs would fix both these except I'd still have a list at rest. Guess I should move a battery to port.

Charlie, check out Bennett's M120 Sport Tabs. You can find complete kit for $389, sometimes less

Who here can give us a before/after tabs impression?

How does everyone feel about how there boat rides at drift? My boat (CC w/ t-top) rolls more than I thought it would. I do a lot of drift fishing in some pretty strong currents/rips around the East End of LI. My boat seems to like to drift beam to the seas (better than drifting stern to) and she rolls pretty damn good. I'm sure the bulky t-top has some effect on that with the higher CG (center of gravity). Even with the 20* deadrise I thought she would roll a bit less. Guess I could've gone with a 14* deadrise boat and been more stable drfting....but then the ride underway would be worse..........you see? As CB said, there's ALWAYS trade offs.

:)

[willy]

I agree with you Tin, I am in a similar situation, most of my fishing is done on a drift. That seems to be the most popular method with most of my friends in the salt. I have been on a bunch of different boats of different sizes and all seem to rock to much to me. Last summer I was invited with some friends for a day of fishing on a 48' Ocean that was a tournament set up boat and beautiful, it rocked and rolled too.
Mine is set up differently to yours and I have no trim tabs, other than making sure my load is as balanced as I can get it I have not found any need for tabs, my Robalo CC rolled more and definetly needed tabs.
I believe the main difference as far as need for tabs was how the boats are balanced. I have seen the same thing on several other boats I have been on, for example my Robalo had close to max power and a heavy Merc V6, it sat stern heavy at rest, not as badly as some I've seen but obviously visible. It would be effected by quartering seas especially and never felt very secure in a handling way, especially considering the excellent hull and very heavy weight and solid construction.
Even though it was almost as heavy as my V20 cuddy it had no where near as nice a ride in various seas and conditions.
I believe it has a lot to do with the fact that my V is what most would consider under-powered with a 115 hp V4, and though a 150 is what I would consider perfect power wise the big advantage to the smaller engine is balance. My V sits perfectly level at rest, I mean bubble level. And from what I have seen on a few different boats that I have thought rode extremely nice they all sat perfectly level at the dock.
My friend with the Grady had a 23 foot Robalo, and removed his t top because he also drifted a lot and it was an older style, very heavy built unit and he said it caused him to roll to much, felt a big difference once removed. It sounds like a trade off you make for comfort and storage vs handling.

[sfprovyn]

I have the bennett tabs on my wellcraft 24 coastal and while they work great, its just something else to fool with and you will definately know if one is up and one is down.... I think If I ever have to replace them it will be with nautica smart tabs. They are cheap and work automatically..The bennetts although have an excellent reputation and they last for years so I will probably not have to fool with it .Frank

[charlie_the_tuna]

tin man, i also have noticed a pretty serious roll at drift but i also have a pretty heavy top on mine.
yes it is a 20 footer but i guess i just expected more, listening to all the praise on the site.
i only have one battery so i dont have the list problem but i also cant trim the thing down enough.
as i said, i am generally happy with the boat in terms of fishing room, (could use a bit more storage) and in flat conditions she gets on plane in seconds and i can keep her on plane at 2,200 rpms. gonna get her out there when the water is like glass and see if we cant get her down to 2,000. i will get her 20 to 30 offshore this season and see just what we can get out of her. good value and seems to be well made. tabs will be a project for down the road a piece and i will just have to suffer it out til then.

[reelapeelin]

Hey Charlie...how much farther ya think she oughtta trim down?...how much ya missin"?... :D...

[bigshrimpin]

This post reminds me of CP's post after his first ride. His I/O was mounted crooked and the boat drove sideways. He was PO'd but once he got the boat setup (riding level) he loved it. I don't want to waste your time here with usless chit chat. You've gotta get the boat riding straight ;)

I had the same problem with my boat, when I had one passenger and the kicker mounted on the boat (also) on the port side. The boat drove like crap . . . ask CB (he got soaked). Tabs will fix this problem.

PS - v20 worship will begin at 5am every morning this week . . . please remember your fishing poles.

[charlie_the_tuna]

bigshrimpin, the boat doesnt ride off side to side... its front to back that i cant trim. shes perfect in terms of side to side pitch. what i CAN do is trim her up so high that im practically looking at the sky but when its a little snotty out i cant bring the bow down low enough to slice through the chop.

reel, i just wanna bring that sharp entry down into the chop.

[brianct12]

Charlie,
Maybe try those "transom wedges" or whatever they are called. You might be able to create more angle with the motor trimmed down all the way - to bring the bow down a bit. I have heard of these but dont have any experience with them

[charlie_the_tuna]

sorry brian, i dont have a clue what you are talking about... what exactly is a transon wedge?

[sfprovyn]

Charlie: I dont know if you have an I/O or an outboard but I have had both in the v-20 and in the I/O version my 82 was very *** heavy with three or more people and rolled a lot. I had trim tabs installed and it made a big difference but it was expensive and took some getting used to. If it were now I would look hard at the nautica automatic Sport Tabs which comes in at around $100 or so and easy to install. My 83 only has a 150 outboard on it and I installed a SE 300 fin for under $50 which jumps it right up on plane and is excellent at keeping the bow down in a nasty head sea at low rpm. Trailer Boat magazine did a comparison on fins and it came out on top .The v-20 is certanly not a perfect boat but has a loyal following for lots of other good reasons but I agree its not the greatest riding and some simple design flaws like scupper's right at water level and floor drains that are almost impossible to get to etc. On the other hand ,If you can level it out it will cut through the slop and keep you dry..I think if wellcraft came out with a v-26 or so with the same v-20 flair with large tanks and twin's it would be a big seller...Frank

[Blue_Runner]

Charlie, do a search on the website or eBay for transom wedges. They are cheap and will help you get your nose down, but....

.....trimmed or not I don't see how you are planning to "slice" through 6 - 8 foot swells in a 20ft boat? Have you been on a 20 footer that could do that? Let me know cause I might sell my V20 and buy one of those!

Blue

[reelapeelin]

Pretty sure he's a I/O and can't use wedges...gonna have to tab that V-20!!... ;)...

[brianct12]

I dont mean to hijack this thread ..... maybe PM me if you would like to respond. When I bought my boat - I was searching for a versatile hull with "near-top" performance in ride capabilities (ie no pounding). If the V-20 isnt close to the "best" in that department - could you list some of the older 20' boats that are better ? Maybe I will keep an eye out for one of those too. I asked this question on THT ... and got one answer - 20' Bertram moppie. OK, fine, but that boat doesnt interest me for many reasons. Thanks

[msbhammer]

Would these work. Cheap price.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NAUTICUS-SMART-TABS-TRIM-TAB-KIT-STABILIZER-SYSTEM_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ31283QQihZ018QQi temZ280008153810QQrdZ1

[bigshrimpin]

Just save the $99 and put it towards a new or used set of real tabs. There is a boat recycler near me that has two sets of bennet tabs for under $150 per set. You have to pull them off the boats . . . point is that there are deals like that around.

If side to side isn't an issue . . . You might look into a permatrim.

[phester]

there was a link for Permatrim somewhere.....can't find it , anybody know?

[chumbucket]

http://www.permatrimmarine.com/

[charlie_the_tuna]

i have an i/o. i have one of the cavitation fins, im not sure which one, and it either works or it doesnt. it was on there when i bought the boat. i will probably install tabs in the future but right now i will suffer it out. i cant imagine those $99. ones do much. im sure they dont work like a $650. set of tabs.

[msbhammer]

Charlie. How about posting some pics. of your boat.

[bigshrimpin]

http://www.permatrimmarine.com/images/diver.jpg

[msbhammer]

Now that isnt you now BigShrimp ?????

[Blue_Runner]

No that's "PermaJim" ;D

[phester]

http://www.permatrimmarine.com/
thanks CB :)

[msbhammer]

Hey what about these. Any better. Fits my budget.
Junk ??
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/SmarTrim-Trim-Tabs-4-Boats-to-20-hydroplane-hydrofoil_W0QQitemZ330009300079QQihZ014QQcategoryZ 26451QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[charlie_the_tuna]

hammer, when i get a chance and figure out how, i will post pics, but i think some of you may already know the boat. i bought it from marc in long beach... you might know him as fishmaster63. i saw that he lived nearby and contacted him to ask if he would sell. when he called me back he said that he had just picked up a new boat and sure could use the money. i went to see it and later that day i was pulling her home.

[phester]

are you on L.I. CTT ?

[phester]

the last time I was out [2 wks. back] I felt like I couldn't trim down to where I needed to be. Heading toward a favorite flukin' spot, seas where loose, 1 1/2 -2 ft. and I know that quartering into it wasn't any help, also heading into the wind, about 10 - 12 mph. The boat was bouncing pretty good....not the ride I am used to because I think the boat rides wonderful. Even my friend noticed a difference in the ride. I came to the conclusion that I've got two batteries side by side just foward of the transom [about 100 lbs.] a FULL tank of fuel, [ 1986 cuddy model, gas tank is somewhat aft] the bimini top was up and into the wind, and lastly, I had little in the way in the way of gear up in the bow. Well, on the way back [no keeper fluke] I dropped the top, the wind was now behind us , and I suppose I burned 1/4 tank....the ride was much better.....tabs will make any boat ride better in nearly all field conditions. I don't think I need to run out and get trim tabs but that Prematrim thing might be worth looking into

[parishht]

I was curios about the pricing and the U.S. distributor
did not have pricing on the website.

Here is the answer I got from them:

Since Permatrims are custom made to match your engine and its color I would need a model engine and your size boat to quote you. For any of the bigger engines (90hp and above) they run between $139 and $211.

Thank you,

Andy

Andrew J. Munao, Jr.
Shipyard Island Marina, Inc.
U.S. Distributor for Permatrim Marine
Toll Free #800-213-3323
Fax #920-847-2066
Website: www.shipyardisland.com
E-mail: [email protected]

[charlie_the_tuna]

phester, L.I. Freeport.

[Blue_Runner]

Hey Charlie, that's cool that you bought FM's boat. Does it still have the hard top on it? Also, was it the one with a 225 Honda on the back? If so, that heavy motor may be what is keeping your nose up.

[bigshrimpin]

Parish - I believe there is a BIG discount if you tell Andy you are a member of thehulltruth.

[phester]

phester, L.I. Freeport.
CTT, Kings Park, right by Sunken Meadow Park

[phester]

Hey Charlie, that's cool that you bought FM's boat. *Does it still have the hard top on it? *Also, was it the one with a 225 Honda on the back? *If so, that heavy motor may be what is keeping your nose up.

FM63 had a nice what looked to be a lightweight hardtop and if I remember there was ALOT of headroom under it....unless you're 6' 9" tall.....nice boat.....oh yeah, it's an I/O..... hey CTT, please tell me FM didn't paint the hull, I think he wanted to and we were all telling him "DON'T DO IT" ......looked to nice to be painted

[msbhammer]

WAIT !!!, Hold they boat. Fishmaster up and sold his boat ???, the same boat he has posted in the gallery ??
Cant be, did he by another V ??
How much and when did all this takes place. Sweat looking v and I love the Hard top. Tell me I am wrong or fill me in on th egossip on why he sold ?

[msbhammer]

Its only 11:30, get out of beds guys and post the story as why fish sold his V. Thats a sweat V. Might have pimped out the wife to get my hands on that V. ;D

[charlie_the_tuna]

yup. thats the one. i/o 350/260 with the sweet hardtop. fishmaster63 went and bought himself a true world marine 24. had them both sitting in his driveway. WHAT A WOMAN! phester, yup, he painted her up but did a beautiful job of it. hadnt even put her in the water yet. said the true world had eaten up alot of his time and money. said he ran into some tough times financially. he was going to bring it down to fla but decided to use it up here. feel kinda bad but i ran him down pretty hard and got a great deal. he said he bought the boat and trailer for $5000. and i gave him $4000. without the trailer. the thing runs like it just came from the factory... just give the throttle two pumps and she starts on the first shot everytime. havent even opened her up yet and dont really see any reason to. brought her up to 3000 rpm and she was moving. been running her at between 2400 and 2800 rpm. dont know how fast were going but it suits me just fine. phester, got a good friend lives in saint james... i believe thats pretty near you.

[msbhammer]

Charlie, You just made a deal of a life time. I always liked that V and hardtop. Good Job !!.

[parishht]

Follow up to my Permatrim pricing poat.

I happened to be paging through my last Boaters World
catalog and found something similar to P-trim,
but a lot less $$$.

I looked on line at their site and here is the link:

http://www.boatersworld.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/SearchView?storeId=10051&catalogId=10051&langId=-1&keyword=hydrofoil

[Blue_Runner]

Why don't you just go ahead and sell me that top Charlie - you know its in your way!

Fellas, I think there's a new DAWG in the house! ;D Nice ride!

BTW, how does that True World look in person? Those are freakin awesome boats! The deep V is incredible. But I've never seen one in person.

[charlie_the_tuna]

blue runner, the top is awesome. rained today but truthfully, it didnt offer much in the way of protection, because it was a horizontal rain.

the true world is an absolutely incredible boat. i just stood there in awe and carressed the gelcoat. from the jackshafted outdrive to the welded 1 inch bowrail the boat just screams quality throughout. just a beautiful boat.
funny though, no fishbox. picture that. $125,000 for a boat and you have to carry a cooler with you for your catch... go figure.

[Blue_Runner]

No fishbox? Well I guess they opted for more room on deck? I love those boats.

[reelapeelin]

Ain't but ONE DAWG in this house ;) ;D ;D...