Question on Boat Purchase (Now With Pics on Pg 2)

[joeithaca00]

Long time reader, first time poster...

I have the opportunity to purchase a 1970's (not sure of year) wellcraft V20 center console. It's not in the best shape (having sunk, due to a bad transom).

So knowing that the boat was sunk and all the wiring, engine, and transom need to be replaced, I'm in a troubled spot. The work doesn't seem to be that bad, but working on a transom gives me a little worry as the margin of error costs 10K. The picture galleries are what's giving me the motivation to do this, I would plan on at least 18 months to do the renovations/repair/repower, but I want to make sure the price is good.

I can get the boat/trailer (and a non-pickled 125 Evinrude) for 1K, a senseless drop in the bucket compared to what I'm planning on putting into it, but does that seem like an ok price (Keep in mind I'm very reluctant to purchase/ride in a boat with a used motor, two horrible experiences).

Also, all of you who have done restorations and posted the results on line, top notch work...I would never have considered anything like this a year ago, but this site is mildly addictive + I love the look of the boat.

[macojoe]

welcome to the site!!

As for the boat, I have a 1975 and love it!!

But $1000 for something that has been sunk and that old to begin with?? I don't think I would do it!!

With the money you are going to spend you can buy a nice hull to start with!!

Were are you located?? We have a member here in FL with a great machine for sale and ready to go!

[Franco]

Hey Joe, I agree with MJ. You can get a nice boat for a lot less than you can rebuils one in that condition. I might be the guy MJ was refering to. I've done almost all the hard work - see previous posts. I would sell her to a good home, I'm looking at another V20 to buy.

[Veeder]

Sunk boat with a bad transom? Run far, and run fast.

[reelapeelin]

It depends on what you WANT...do you want a project of which you can take pride in the workmanship and enjoy after the work's done?...or do you want a boat you can use/enjoy while in progress...either way, you'll love the V20...the project will be a long haul...a boat you can enjoy along the way is a lot more fun... ;D...

[joeithaca00]

Thanks for the quick feedback.

This would be something that I would use more to enjoy the workmanship. I was thinking of doing this instead of buying a new boat, I would work towards replacing absolutely everything (something I would enjoy).

There are a few fears that I have with this, first and most obvious is the fact it sank and secondly I don't have a clue as to the time commitment this would take to properly restore, I'm guestimating somewhere around 200 - 250 hours (probably high).

[Franco]

I think your time estimate is low unless you can give 5 weeks time uninterrupted. I cant tell you how many hours I have spent working on my boat, let alone the planning and research. But I agree, it is a very satisfying experience. I had an idea about what a boat should be and set out to make mine that boat. You'll start out with a great boat, and make it into what you want. Go for it !!! This is a great place to get advice. These guys have a lot of experience doing everything on a boat - good and bad. Welcome aboard and dont get your nortons in a bunch!!!

[Mac_Attack]

I like to do projects too. Small ones that is. If your willing and able to to a total rebuild go for it! Me I'd buy Franco's and be fishing tomarrow. Cut the price in half $500 Bill Mc ;D

[phester]

I think Fillet1 [we have'nt heard much from him lately] is selling his boat.He did a fine job on "upgrades", I dont think it was a full restoration...but it sure looks like it was.Joe, try to get to the v20 gallery,Fillet1s boat is I believe on the last page,Good luck and welcome to the board.

[macojoe]

Well if a project is what you want a project is what you are going to get!!

First IMO a boat is a never ending project!! So 250 hours is not going to be close to what you will put into this boat.

We no your looking at the transom for repairs, but it has been sunk and for how long??
If the stringers are full of water then your going to have to tear the floor out!

I could be wrong but I think your looking a a full redo!! Tear up the floors and all! You will have to strip this to a bath tub and start from strach.

Just remember that you have a long long long road ahead of you!! and boat stuff is not cheap!!

$1000 dollar for a sunk boat for a complete redo is a bit much IMO, Look around and see what you can find cheap, or try to get this one cheaper??

Good luck and ask all you want!! And we need pictures!! No pic no advice ;D

[shicks007]

What are the details of the motor? How about a compromise? I think if you keep your eyes peeled you can find a project boat that would require less extensive repairs and still give you plenty of work that you would be proud of. I think you have the right mind set and are on the right track though.

Good luck,
Scott

[reelapeelin]

Joe...all the above having been said, PLUS the fact that I own a '74...if I were gonna embark on the complete rebuild you have in mind, I would start w/a hull that came from the factory w/the gas tank in the floor, which would move you to '79 or later...this boat would also have a full liner and FLOTATION...and a 25" transom...ALL definate improvements to the basic boat... ;)...

Somebody had one for a dollar the other day that would be ZAKLY what you're lookin' for... 8)...

[shicks007]

Those are some good points RAP. A self bailing cockpit would be a plus also.

[reelapeelin]

Yes it would...that dollar boat turned out to be a '76...but there are several later models that have come thru here and will in the future that will fill the bill...be patient and find what you want before you buy... ;D...

[Skools Out]

You'd be better off to find a later boat for sure 78' was the first yr of the tanks in the floor and self draining decks with rod box's. Keep looking. I bought sunkin boat and redid it. Was a nightmare every thing was wet the stringers, floor, transom, even the back of the dash all steering will have to be changed to be safe. all wiring too. If it has sunk expect to have a complete redo. Plus you will have to fill the boat with water before you ever start any work on it. Fill it to the water line at least and see where it has leaks or soft glass from water damage. It may take a couple hours but leave the water in it to see if it ever seeps out somewhere. Draw a line in the boat to see it it goes down too. If a boat will hold water inside no leaks then it will hold water out, works both ways. Just an easy way to test one without putting it in the water to find it actually leaks.

Here was the boat when i found my sunk one eyes don't tell all.

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a46/Skools_Out/Manatee/RedBoat13.jpg

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a46/Skools_Out/Manatee/RedBoat14.jpg

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a46/Skools_Out/Manatee/RedBoat11.jpg

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a46/Skools_Out/Manatee/RedBoat12.jpg

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a46/Skools_Out/Manatee/RedBoat20.jpg

once finished a year and a half later

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a46/Skools_Out/Manatee/red_boat_34.jpg

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a46/Skools_Out/Manatee/red_boat_32.jpg

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a46/Skools_Out/Manatee/red_boat_23.jpg

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a46/Skools_Out/Manatee/red_boat_25.jpg

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a46/Skools_Out/Manatee/red_boat_27.jpg

Trust me been there and Don't do that it's a real Bitty. If there is wood in a sunk boat better expect to replace it.

[joeithaca00]

This is one active site, I typically use Ctfisherman.com as my advice column but you guys seem to have a lot of experience you bring to the table. I'll work on getting pictures for the weekend.

Also the boat was sunk for about 3 hours. It went down at the dock, they lawyer who owned it knew the scuppers (I think) was letting water in and he didn't have an automatic bilge pump installed, he was actrually paying a kid to go down to the dock and turn on the bilge pump. Fortunately where it went down the marina has a crane that they pulled it out with.

I wouldn't even try and get this motor started, it's clean but the salt water probably shot everything in there. I would probably try and sell the lower unit (probably the only salvagable part).

Anyone know of any V20 CC for sale in Connecticut or the northeast. Still looking for a project boat but all of your advice makes me want to try a smaller restoration.

[macojoe]

Yes like RP says, a newer hull will be a much better project!!
There have been more then one older V20 sunk at the dock!! They had no floation before 79 I belive. nWellcraft says they will float but that was only by air traped in the bottom. They would get caught under a dock edge and as the tide goes out it would just pull it down.
The newer hulls have a smaller freeboard (not much) to allow for the floation, and a self bailing deck is great!!

I have a 75 so all water has to go to the bildge and be pumped out as there is no self bailing deck :(

one thing I will suggest is in your search, look for a I/O boat. You can add a bracket to it and have a full transom. IMO this is the only way to go!

[Blue_Runner]

Hey Joe, where you goin with that gun in your hand...

Oh, sorry, got caught up in some Hendrix there. Let me try again...

Hey Joe, I admire your ambition to take on such a project. First off, I agree that a thousand is too much to pay for a sunken early 70's V20. Me personally, I wouldn't buy one because I wouldn't want to have to go into the floor. Transom, maybe, floor - not me man.

All of the advice the others gave, I agree with. Just don't buy a 2001 V21 for $35,000 and I think you'll be ok. We all hate euro-transom they put on that model cause it takes up so much cockpit space.

you guys seem to have a lot of experience you bring to the table

The difference is that this is a specialty site whereas CTfisherman is a catch-all. These guys know their V20's inside and out!

It's no different than finding the right girl - ride on as many as you can and then pick the best one ;D

[reelapeelin]

Yep...that's the way I picked my wife!...

And lemme tell ya...if Skool said it would be a nightmare...RUN...he's real good w/this stuff and if HE ain't goin', I ain't goin'...

Hey Skool...how'd ya do on the red boat...she really looked good...

[Skools Out]

that red boat was a great boat once i finished it. it ran out so good , i rebuilt that motor to a 140 but decals were 120 so it would be coast guard legal. was rated for 135 lol. with a stainless 13 1/4 x 18 OMC prop it ran out at 41 mph and turned 5750 rpms. I hated to sell it, That boat i hate to say this on this site lol but it road better than the V-20 *??? But i sold it when i found the V-20. Sold the Manatee on a Friday night and went to the beach, bought and picked up the Wellcraft on that Sat. lol. That was a prototype boat that had a hand scribed Hull numbers. It's HIN # i'll never forget cause it was the boats birthday lol. # was V. 10 4673 which come to find out was the 10th boat built by the Manatee company as there prototype pn 4/6/73 lol. It was a heavy over built boat but had a ton of wet wood.


and Hey Joe,
*That boat had sunk in a hurricane was floated the next day and the guy used it 2 more years and then it sat 3 more years and the wood was still wet. Time out of water doesn't matter. If it can't get air it won't dry. Plus it was warped up in alot of areas from being wet. making stuff fit after it dried was a true nightmare. *PS i say RUN RUN RUN and Don't look back. Let someone else fix that wet julopa. If it's a cuddy boat the front top deck will be wet and bad too.

[reelapeelin]

"rode better than a V20"...yes, you have committed high treason by speaking the unspeakable...OFF w/his Nortons!!... ;D...

[Skools Out]

LOL yeah but i sold the old Manatee to buy the V20.

[reelapeelin]

OK...keep the Nortons then...wouldn't want the word to get around we're not tolerant or anything... ::)...

[CT_V-20]

BUY A NEW BOAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[joeithaca00]

Here are the pictures that I just took, I could be wrong about the year of the boat. Anyone have any idea?

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a179/joeithaca00/IM000111.jpg
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a179/joeithaca00/IM000110.jpg http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a179/joeithaca00/IM000108.jpg http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a179/joeithaca00/IM000102.jpg


I have a bunch more, but am not sure if I uploaded them properly. If anyone would like to see more let me know.

Thanks,

Joe

[reelapeelin]

Gotta be a '79-'80 or newer...25" transom and raised cap...does it have scuppers and a 60 gal. tank?... :)...look at the starboard transom, under the rub-rail...see any numbers?...last two are year model...on most any production boat...unless it's transom got rebuilt...

High bow-rail...must be after-market as it comes down on the pulpit...nice job on both... :D...

[joeithaca00]

Yea, the scuppers are actually where the problem originated, there wasn't a complete seal and you can see the rot right in there. It looks like they tried to fix it, but didn't do a hell of a job.

Here is a picture of the scuppers


http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a179/joeithaca00/IM000103.jpg

[steplift20]

listen to me dont do it
you can get a better boat and it would still need work
i have a 1978 steplift and am constantly working on it and it doesnt need anything
get what im trying to say good luck

[reelapeelin]

RULE #1 when looking for a boat to buy: DON'T fall in love w/anything til AFTER you buy it...easy to say...hard to do, but let your common sense and practicality take over as you look around... ;) :)...leave the emotions at home...take the "game-face" w/you...

[macojoe]

Just check it out good!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I would not worry about the motor to much as by the look of it you will replace down the line!!
Use it to lower the price!!

As or the boat, if it checks out good and you decide your getting it, It looks nice!!
I love the bow rail and pulpit! and the Radar Arch I think its a good locker!

[joeithaca00]

If I went ahead with this I would go into it knowing I would have to replace everything. I also would pretty much only get it now if he gave it to me for the price of the trailer.

How much would you expect to spend on a full restoration of this boat (excluding motor), I'm banking on 4-5K, the motor is another story.

Also, I went and took another look at the boat, the serial number on the transom says it's an 82.

[Blue_Runner]

Joe, after seeing it, I now think you should buy it and then promply sell me that radar arch! ;D ;D

Just kiddin man. If you really want to do the work and the price is right, go ahead and do it!

[reelapeelin]

An 82 has got flotation in it...I don't think that makes it "unsinkable"...but did that boat go to the bottom or was it "swamped"?... ???...

[joeithaca00]

The motor was partially submerged, it did a half tilt. The controls and steering stayed out of the water.

I would assume the floatation would need to be replaced as well, it's normally a good idea anyway.