Brand new mid hp motor?

[RidgeRunner]

So I am looking at a 90 to 115 hp outboard 20" shaft to repower a skiff. My NV boat has been such a good old girl and is so unique as to be downright worthless to most. I am going to do the right thing and freshen her up a little. New trolling motor, GPS, outboard and a fresh rig job, rebuild a couple hatches and re-seal the transom. 18 year old boat deserves it, right?

Looking hard at the new 115 Mercury 4-stroke - Lightweight of the crowd at 365 dry I think it is lighter than the Opti. Has an Suzuki is out due to lack of dealers in my area. Honda, Yamaha and Johnson/Evinrude are all palatable choices.
Anyone got any opinions? First hand or otherwise.

BTW- The motor I am looking to replace is a 90hp Johnson crossflow from 1994. It still runs but is looking a little rough around the edges. If anyone is interested let me know as it is for sale as of right now. Cheap, make offer.

The boat5692

[randlemanboater]

Does Bombardier still sell the Zuk as a Johnson?

If so, you know my vote.

[spareparts]

90 Yamaha? Lighter than the 115, will push a 17 Montauk with no problem, has plenty of power for a 90. I've re powered two 17 Montauk with them, turned out pretty good

[phatdaddy]

i've got a friend that repowered a 20 dusky with the new 150 merc 4 stroke. he loves it. i'm guessing the 115 is a smaller version.
have you had any experience with tohatsu. i repowered my 13 whaler in 03 with a 40 and it's been a great little motor. i think that was the last years of the carbed 2 strokes. i've heard good things about the tldi's they have now. buying one is like buying a dodge truck, you better like it , cause nobody will give you anything for it.

[the daydreamer]

A friend of mine just repowered his 17 montauk with a 90 hp yamaha and is well satisfied!!!!

[RidgeRunner]

So there are more than a couple Yamaha 90 hp fans. I hear you, and Spare is right on the 115 Yamaha is a lot heavier. Still lurking at this NEW Merc with the High Thrust lower unit option. HT lower has a 2.33 gear and has the same diameter gearcase as the v-6 Mercs so the prop choices go through the roof. With only 115 ponies that lower ought to hold on for years. That is important to me, I am tough on lower units and skegs in particular. Pricing on the Yamaha seems to be a little higher than the Merc offering as was the E-tec. They are really selling the no service for three years on the Johnrudes. Suzuki and Tohatsu are out simply because I don't have a friend that owns a dealership, like I do on the other products.
Switching away from Johnson I will need to replace all the controls which i$ going to add up real fa$t. Even if I didn't trade brands I would replace it all anyways. Might trade the old engine for some new controls.. Might even be forced to do a little glass work to the console while I am there, the binnacle control on the Johnson has a huge footprint. IIRC There are definitely new battery cables in my future, I am fairly sure the original rigger used a cheap set of jumper cable wires on a Monday morning Budweiser googles screwjob! Yep a complete re-rig is a coming. 3 stators and a weak start later... No more putting this off. Time to do it.

[RidgeRunner]

i've got a friend that repowered a 20 dusky with the new 150 merc 4 stroke. he loves it. i'm guessing the 115 is a smaller version.
have you had any experience with tohatsu. i repowered my 13 whaler in 03 with a 40 and it's been a great little motor. i think that was the last years of the carbed 2 strokes. i've heard good things about the tldi's they have now. buying one is like buying a dodge truck, you better like it , cause nobody will give you anything for it.

That last statement there is how I feel about the boat. I had heard Tohatsu was tough as cut nails. Mercury used them for a few of their smaller hp motors back in the late 80's. IIRC The 40 was one that Mercury didn't make. Never heard anything but good. Same of the Yamahas except for a oil pan corrosion issue on some of the 90's. My neighbor's for instance...

[spareparts]

do you think a 70 would push it? the 70 Yamaha seems to be the #1 choice of the flats guys around here, granted they are pushing lighter boats, but the 70 is lighter than the 90 and seems to be a very strong 70

[RidgeRunner]

A 90 does it justice. On plane fast with a old Mach 4 blade prop, ran the boat to near 40 WOT. 70 seems a little lacking in a 4-stroke I would think. But that 70 Yamaha is a sweet little package.

Yamaha 115 2-stroke is what I wet tested on the hull before I bought one. No regrets, I went used 90 hp Johnson on a new boat. It got me on the water, this time I am going to pony up. Literally. I think a 115 4-stroke is what it needs. I should be able to put it on plane and make fuel at 3500 RPM -- close to 7MPG cruising.. Stoked because the ole 2-smoke does not get 2 MPG I kid you knot...

[spareparts]

you need to find some one that has one of the newer fourstrokes on a boat similar in size to what you have and take it for a spin. The newer engines are not lacking in power, teh 70 and 90 are both new engine designs(in the last couple years any way). The 115 is still teh same engine they have been making for a while. I've heard of several people opting for the new 90 over hte 115 because of weight and negligible difference in power. If it were a heavier boat, I'd definitely say go with the 115, but knowing its a shallow water boat, the weight difference may be worth the loss of hp, minimal as it is

[RidgeRunner]

The 115 Merc is all new. From Merc -- It is a single OHC 4 valve per cylinder Inline 4 that is 20 lbs lighter than any of the competitors offerings. 315 lbs is where I was, 360 is where I will be with more hp on tap. So, If I shift my snakebite formula from the rear of the boat to the middle or front, the weight should not be a factor. Besides I just lost 65 pounds and the pilot sits near the stern, just saying..

[THEFERMANATOR]

Weight is HUGE with a flat bottom, or mostly flat bottom skiffs. I would find another boat with newer power on it and try it out. If going new, I would put weight at the top of my list of deciding factors, and HP 2nd. I know I have seen some skiffs repowered with newer power, and it made the boats almost unfishable by adding 100 pounds in the stern.

[RidgeRunner]

This inverted V has a couple quirks but weight carrying is not a problem.
In Mercury (4-strokes and the Opti's)and the e-tec Johnson/Erude the 75,90,115 are all the same weight. Same displacement and size motors with different hp ratings. So I am not considering putting 45 pounds of additional weight back there without maxing out the hp to weight ratio in the category.
Yamaha motors are completely different going from the 90 to the 115. Pricey all of them. I think I want the Mercury because of the deal/dealers in my area. I lean American, is th Merc even made here anymore?

[spareparts]

If you are going Merc then go all the way. 150xs!!!!!!

[RidgeRunner]

Boat has a hp rating of 115, or I would have put Ozzie's 200 on it. With the 20" Mariner Magnum mid that you got. I thought about it, real hard, but then look where I would be now. Ultimately I am going for economy not speed.. The main quirk to the hull is it will never be fast, it has a huge rocker with hull extentions that plants the sponsons the more power you give it. It squeezes the water between the sponsons and creates a super cavitated mix of water as it goes over the lower unit, quirk #2. This might all sound a little unwanted in a skiff, but it will run places it can't even float, plane off in frog spit and is as stable a fishing platform as you can get in the size. With the larger gearcase and prop, it should be even faster to plane, like 2 seconds in two boatlengths. So quick and efficient and legal.

Think Hickman Sea Sled with a little more deadrise at the transom. LOL!
http://www.winninghoff.com/common/index.php?com=winn&div=EE&nav=EE&page=E01

[RidgeRunner]

Committed myself to the Mercury motor today. Controls and harness cost just north of $500 clams at a decent discount I might add.. Ouch!
Spare I will finally get to use those Smartcraft gauges that have been sitting on my shelf for how many years? Talk about new old stock...
Now I need to get the rest of the Johnrude off this old girl and start with some more glass work. The dash will need to be reconfigured/recored as the bonehead (ME) that rigged it 18 years ago didn't seal up around the gauges too well (AT ALL) and allowed water to rot the core in the dash..(In one little spot but because I am anal) I mean who knew, I never had anything fancy enough to need a gauge before NV. :embarsed: I finally found a camera. If I only had a couple double A batteries. It is always something.

Epiphany - I have fully embraced the fact that I am going to find many a mistake by doing it wrong the first time..

[RidgeRunner]

The 115 is slow coming from Mercury ( Another Month of waiting) so I said "Screw It" and plan to rig the 250 EFI instead. With a 25" leg I should have the prop in some clean water and be able to get the bow up and flying on the flats boat..

Seriously, the 90 Yamaha is 380 lbs, just a squeeze more than the 115 Merc 4-stroke. E-tec is 320 for the 90 hp 380 for the 115 (so the e-tec is heavier than the NEW 115 4-stroke from Merc) That is interesting..
Still what a kick to the scrotum to find out Mercury won't have more motors to ship until 9/11/14......... Unbe:cen:lievable!

[RWilson2526]

Committed myself to the Mercury motor today. Controls and harness cost just north of $500 clams at a decent discount I might add.. Ouch! .

Shoot, you throw more than that away on any given day.

[RidgeRunner]

Oh Yeeouch! You had to go there, I can only assume that reference is for the lost wallet.. I have not fully recovered from that one..
That is cold. I feel the love here. LOL! Thanks Wilson.
I could always sell that Merc stuff on fleabay.. Go Yamaha?

OR Let me bank account recover a bit and then pull the trigger. Just hate waiting around and the boat was supposed to be ready for the Labor Day debut... Sucks, just saying!!

[bradford]

Congrats on your soon to be new engine Ridge!

[reelapeelin]

you need to find some one that has one of the newer fourstrokes on a boat similar in size to what you have and take it for a spin. The newer engines are not lacking in power, teh 70 and 90 are both new engine designs(in the last couple years any way). The 115 is still teh same engine they have been making for a while. I've heard of several people opting for the new 90 over hte 115 because of weight and negligible difference in power. If it were a heavier boat, I'd definitely say go with the 115, but knowing its a shallow water boat, the weight difference may be worth the loss of hp, minimal as it is

Daughter's boyfriend has new 90 on his 17' flats boat...it's a ZIP SLED!!
:party:

[RidgeRunner]

Sorry I got distracted earlier Reel.. Busy day. I hear all of the weight concerns loud and clear. Which is why I am attempting to buy the lightest weight 4-stroke motor made in 115 hp. This new mota at 2.1 liter is a lot of displacement yet 40 pounds lighter than the old 1.7 liter/115. Makes more torque than the old 2-strokes according to Merc.

This is the motor I originally tested on the demo boat. It is 10 pounds lighter than the 4 -stroke Mercury. http://www.outboard-engine.com/enginespecs.php?recordID=238
They have made some inroads in the weight department.

Thanks Bradford for the congratulations;-) It will be my first new engine...
Hope I ain't steppin' up to be another guinea pig (read TEST BIT*H) for Merc.. NEW MOTOR AND ALL! OH good goodness, knock on wood! We will have EXTENDED Warranty and a full understanding of the lemon law before we initialize that final contract, just to be safe.

[RidgeRunner]

Mercury spent a few hours testing this motor before release. They claim that the mid-hp motors are 30% of the outboard segment. They surely needed to get it right with such stiff competition from the Japanese. But did they?
Well, the motor is in (exactly when they said it would be) and I am still not ready. Still need to do some rigging and my new switch plate hasn't arrived yet. One of my delays involves a USPS delivery. The US mail cannot deliver a package to an address unless that address has a mailbox?? WTF? That is why UPS, FEDEX, DHL and others cost a tad more but your package will get there. Bear in mind this package will no way fit into a mailbox and the postage carrier must get a signature so they must go to the door. They never even tried. OK OK, I knew they wouldn't deliver here but I had no idea there was anyone that still used USPS to ship packages either.

Now is time for a plug for NEWWIREMARINE out of Charleston, SC. They do marvelous work with switches. They use the best switchgear and have some of the finest workmanship I have ever seen. Laser engraved backlit Contura switches are what lit me up, no pun intended. My hommemade switchplate wasn't up to the task, aesthetically. Yeah, I know skiffs ain't supposed to be pretty. If that motor had been here earlier I would have been fishing by now instead of spending dollars on switchgear...

Meanwhile, Instead of bringing back the Black Cloud Thread I thought I would inform you all, I am officially out from under that SOB... I burned up a lower unit Labor Day weekend and that was the end of the BAD LUCK. There I said it.. My health is also returning to normal. Thank you all for your prayers. It means a world to me to have such caring folks on here share their support and good wishes. I woke up this morning for the seventh consecutive day feeling good. What a struggle this has been. Haven't even been scalloping all year.

[THEFERMANATOR]

Mercury spent a few hours testing this motor before release. They claim that the mid-hp motors are 30% of the outboard segment. They surely needed to get it right with such stiff competition from the Japanese. But did they?
Well, the motor is in (exactly when they said it would be) and I am still not ready. Still need to do some rigging and my new switch plate hasn't arrived yet. One of my delays involves a USPS delivery. The US mail cannot deliver a package to an address unless that address has a mailbox?? WTF? That is why UPS, FEDEX, DHL and others cost a tad more but your package will get there. Bear in mind this package will no way fit into a mailbox and the postage carrier must get a signature so they must go to the door. They never even tried. OK OK, I knew they wouldn't deliver here but I had no idea there was anyone that still used USPS to ship packages either.

Now is time for a plug for NEWWIREMARINE out of Charleston, SC. They do marvelous work with switches. They use the best switchgear and have some of the finest workmanship I have ever seen. Laser engraved backlit Contura switches are what lit me up, no pun intended. My hommemade switchplate wasn't up to the task, aesthetically. Yeah, I know skiffs ain't supposed to be pretty. If that motor had been here earlier I would have been fishing by now instead of spending dollars on switchgear...

Meanwhile, Instead of bringing back the Black Cloud Thread I thought I would inform you all, I am officially out from under that SOB... I burned up a lower unit Labor Day weekend and that was the end of the BAD LUCK. There I said it.. My health is also returning to normal. Thank you all for your prayers. It means a world to me to have such caring folks on here share their support and good wishes. I woke up this morning for the seventh consecutive day feeling good. What a struggle this has been. Haven't even been scalloping all year.
I know the feeling. I seen an NV for sale on CL the other day and thought of yours. Could have saved you a bunch of work for only $38,500, yep the bargain basement price of $38,500 for one redone with a newer engine on it.

As for scalloping, I haven't been either, but I hope to Sunday before the season ends. Been busy lately with a funeral, and the last few weeks has been getting ready for my son's 2nd birthday party we had yesterday. And good to here about your health, I know you weren't in the best of shape last time I seen yeah.

[RidgeRunner]

Holy smoke what a bargain. Just $38,500. On a serious note the last ones made had a full liner and a couple were carbon and kevlar, many rigged with towers.. Rare, only because there were so few built. Probably no more than 40 boats in all.

[THEFERMANATOR]

Holy smoke what a bargain. Just $38,500. On a serious note the last ones made had a full liner and a couple were carbon and kevlar, many rigged with towers.. Rare, only because there were so few built. Probably no more than 40 boats in all.
This one has a tower. Says it was an 07, but wasn't finished out until 2013. Could have saved yourself a bunch of trouble and just bought this one finished out.

http://tampa.craigslist.org/hil/boa/4662801292.html

[RidgeRunner]

That is a bunch of lettuce right there. Too fat for my wallet. I purchased in 1996 and gave $5400 for the boat and $2000 for the trailer. Rigged it with a used 90 hp for another $3k trolling motor $1k misc. rigging and I had about $12 k complete in 1996. I may spend that again refitting this old girl. Looking at $10k so far for: new 115 hp Merc, Trolling motor, depth finder/GPS combo, plus the misc. which always manages to break the budget.
I must say the rigging hardware that Mercury sent with their high dollar control box is nothing short of silly. It should be a 1/4"-20 size and they give a #8 screw and well nuts. Laughable. Then they give 40 feet of neutral safety switch wire and then I am looking at all the do-dads on this wire harness, holy. I need a computer geek and a Merc Master Tech. I wonder if the Geek Squad guys speak Mercury? It is all plug and play really, just finding a place to tie all the wires up is going to be interesting. I have zero hope for doing anything but a civil tie up job. Trying to make it look good would be time consuming while standing on your head under the way too small dash. I almost have a picture to share...:oh:

[phatdaddy]

ridge, what lower unit do you need, i have 3 and looking to move all of my merc stuff. put money down on a new 150 merc 4s, let me know and i'll meet you in perry.

[RidgeRunner]

It is a 3.0Liter Torquemaster 25" that I just burned up. None of the 2.5 stuff works on it. SEI has them with a warranty for around $1K. I actually have one in the shed already, it just has the wrong length driveshaft in it. Should not be too difficult a fix, I found a man that can weld up or replace the shaft to make it whatever length I need.
Not to shoot you down at all. I am always open to suggestions/ looking for spares, so if you have something let me know and thanks. Vic

[RidgeRunner]

UPDATE:

The one holding the purse strings is the only one seemingly interested in getting this project done. Today is the fire up the peons day. Time to get something done once and for all. Waiting on a dealer to order a couple of critical items. Like a junction box for the Smartcraft Gauges and a couple of control cables. Then I am still having shipping issues on another item or two. Either the dealer will get the stuff I need today or I will just order it online and have it tomorrow or the next day from boats.net or iboats.com.

This project began three weeks before Labor Day. This waiting around is making me stir crazy.

[THEFERMANATOR]

On a plus side, you didn't miss much for scallop season. Went out SUnday to the same area we went to last year, and between 2 of us in 3 hours only magaed about a gallon in the shell. We searched and searched, went out deep past the other boats, in shallow, on top of the other boats, but still ended up with next to nothing. Of course fishing is Chass wasn't much better. Saw LOTS of BIG fish, but none would take a lure. Only ended up with one 16 inch trout. We hooked into some ladyfish, but lost them all to some big trout. That was the worst was sight casting to some MONSTER trout, seeing come up and stare at whatever we through at them, but they wouldn't take a lure. Hook a ladyfish though, and lose it instantly to a trout. Saw one that had to have been 28 inches if he was an inch. Looked like a friggen snook with spots it was so thick. Or the big school of bull reds we drifted over that just stared at us.

[RidgeRunner]

Well, that is not at all what I wanted to hear but I might feel a little better about not going. Crazy about the gator trout not hitting. They are fairly aggressive this time of year. Redfish doesn't surprise me much. That is why I need to go. I want to have trout defy my lures right to my face. Redfish too. LOL!

Well there is some progress with the parts and pieces. Switch panel shall arrive in the a.m. and the dealer might get a reprive until tomorrow morning..those parts are on the UPS truck today too.. Happy Happy

Pictures soon I promise. :love:

[RidgeRunner]

Found my pin pushing tool (Radio Shack) to change around a couple of Molex connectors. Mercury sent the controls for an I/O instead of an outboard the main difference is that the trim switch has four wires? Harness only has three and the plugs are very different. I can surmise the extra wire is for some version of trim limit/trailer tilt ? Who knows but the plastic molex 4-wire connectors from Radio Shack did the trick. Used the same setup for the jack-plate control wires. Ran new 1 Ga primary wire from the battery under the console to the transom and yanked the 18 year old jumper cable wires and extention chord (Orange) that the builder used to wire the old girl originally. I have literally changed every wire.
A few connections to solder up and we will be running in no time.

[RidgeRunner]

J-box -- check
Control Cables -- check
Switch Panel -- check
:news::time:

[RidgeRunner]

Progress... Finally...

Switch panel in all rigging done ready for a motor
5742

5743

5744

[RidgeRunner]

That first picture reveals a speedo that goes to 80.. Pfffft! :zip:

[RidgeRunner]

Manic these days. The highs and lows of refitting a damn boat..

Motor is being unboxed as I type.. Dealer recommends insurance. I nearly forgot that little 4 letter word:bat: Ummm, well Yeah! That would be prudent in this case.

Stated value is the only way I can go with this old a boat. Anyone have any recommendations on what carrier I might call?
Thanks in advance...

[RidgeRunner]

Those Merc Platinum cables cost a bit more but silk generally doe$.

OK, I am stoked about the NEW motor again. Like I said manic...
Medicated for your protection, TOO! I always loved that sig line..

[THEFERMANATOR]

Don't know about for a boat, but I know on my BURB the only reasoneably priced stated value policy I could find was southern auto owners. They were less than half what others wanted for a stated value policy, and were pretty easy to deal with as far as getting it(only wanted pictures and a description, others wanted itemized receipts).

[randlemanboater]

Manic these days. The highs and lows of refitting a damn boat..

Motor is being unboxed as I type.. Dealer recommends insurance. I nearly forgot that little 4 letter word:bat: Ummm, well Yeah! That would be prudent in this case.

Stated value is the only way I can go with this old a boat. Anyone have any recommendations on what carrier I might call?
Thanks in advance...



I have Progressive...havent had to use them, but it is pretty cheap and easy to deal with online.

[RidgeRunner]

:sun:Thanks Ferm and Randall, I will get on it in the morning.
Meanwhile..5745

5746

5747

5748

[RidgeRunner]

I can't wait to try this thing. Break-in forthcoming. I can almost taste the fish now.. :beer:

[randlemanboater]

Sweet!

[phatdaddy]

tell me about it ridge, i am trying to get mine ready to take to the dealer monday. i went to the dealer yesterday and he was mounting twin 150's on a parker. they had the cowlings off, the only thing i recognized was the spark plug wires.

like rmb, i had progressive on the v the first 5 years i had the new motor on it back in 95. it was around $250 a year for around $10,000. worth of coverage.

looks good, enjoy

[bradford]

MJ or Valiant, I still can't see any of Ridge's pics. HELP!

[RidgeRunner]

How about the link I sent for the one picture Bradford?
http://www.wellcraftv20.com/community/attachment.php?attachmentid=5745&d=1411681222

[Destroyer]

Hey Ridge... As a favor to you,(so you can have more time to do other things), I'll be happy to take the boat and do the break in for you for a few years or so.. No, no,...... no thanks needed... it's the least I can do for a fellow boater. :beer:

[THEFERMANATOR]

Hey Ridge... As a favor to you,(so you can have more time to do other things), I'll be happy to take the boat and do the break in for you for a few years or so.. No, no,...... no thanks needed... it's the least I can do for a fellow boater. :beer:

I'll do him one better. I will gladly let him fill it up, and then come over and do the break in for him. Even test the hull/prop integrity on a few rocks out on the flats for him. Since I'm local I can do this service for him on short notice.

[RidgeRunner]

While I do appreciate the generosity of the offer Destroyer, Ferman has first dibbs. Shall I take a casting of what the skeg looks like now, as in a BEFORE picture. Seriously, might be the last chance to see it intact. :haha: Time to see what this thing can do. To the lake.

[THEFERMANATOR]

While I do appreciate the generosity of the offer Destroyer, Ferman has first dibbs. Shall I take a casting of what the skeg looks like now, as in a BEFORE picture. Seriously, might be the last chance to see it intact. :haha: Time to se what this thing can do. To the lake.
Hey now, my skeg on my jon boat is still intact(by some miracle I don't know how, that oyester bar last weekend was HARD!). I will say my SOLAS aluminum prop is one tough SOB. I hit some stuff with it that would have WRECKED a michigan wheel, and it just got some knicks in the blades(which polished right out with a scotch brite pad on my grinder).

[spareparts]

I'll bring beer and sandwiches

[RidgeRunner]

Well I just got back from the lake and I am impressed with the torque. Cruised around for break-in which reads nothing over 4500 for the first 2 hours and vary throttle often. Took lunch, which is damn good news, I am getting my appetite back. Just put an hour on it and it is incredible how much additional thrust the larger prop and deeper gears make. Seriously it is on plane in a boatlength and a half and will stay on plane with light load (me) down to about 10.5 mph. Fantastic news because the flat bottom has a tendency to beat your fillings out in the rough. The larger gearcase does seem to give some additional stern lift at speed and it is possible to jack the motor all the way up and the boat will still get on plane and run. No way the old Johnson case and 15P prop were up to that task. The bow rise coming out of the hole is nearly imperceptable so it is hard to really put a stopwatch to it. Half again faster than the 90 Johnson that was no slug to start with. The prop I borrowed off the V-20 is the Thunderbolt Quicksilver 21P. It swings it without a problem but who knows on top end. Couple more hours to go before we find out. This is absolutely the quietest motor I ever owned. In neutral you can hear the water stream as it breaks friction from the telltale. In and out of Forward and Reverse is quiet. Trim buttom is funky on the up. It snaps. No tach for the trip.. None of the gauges worked. The Merc Tech that hung and rigged the motor said they did?? I was more interested in how it floats and what the extra weight would do. I think it is very close to the old setup.. Self bailing without a problem, no hop, nothing but quiet performance. Everything you ever wanted fom a outboard motor, including the PC of 3 star super-low emission status and no bad 2-stroke oil. :zip:
Oh yeah, motor mounts are loose as a goose in this thing. It shimmys and shakes back there but you can't feel a thing. In fact that is about the only way to tell if it is running at idle if your more than 10 feet away.
I have gotten used to the solid mounts in the big Merc. This is a departure from that. Nothing but good, a few loose ends to tie up as you would expect. Smiles:party: Now for a nap and tear back into the dash area again... build fence at the house, bathroom remodel, the list is growing I think..

[smokeonthewater]

Congrats!!!!!!

[bradford]

Congrats Ridge!!! Sounds great!

[RidgeRunner]

Thanks for the support. Still haven't tore into the gauge situation. I popped the lid to make sure the terminators were in place. I have a harness that is all ty-wrapped under dash I guess I will start there. Plug and play? :arrr: Sounds like a good idea to me, what caliber shall I use?

[RidgeRunner]

On a positive note I got some fence built between me and the neighbor with the 10 month old American Bulldog (read climber). It took most of the day Sunday but we knocked it out. 4x6x10' post with 2x4x16' rails and 5/4x6 Premium RED for the picketts. Heck of a heavy booger anyhow. If the dog scales this one we will need to rethink fence building.

[THEFERMANATOR]

On a positive note I got some fence built between me and the neighbor with the 10 month old American Bulldog (read climber). It took most of the day Sunday but we knocked it out. 4x6x10' post with 2x4x16' rails and 5/4x6 Premium RED for the picketts. Heck of a heavy booger anyhow. If the dog scales this one we will need to rethink fence building.
Nope, go to tractor supply and get you an electric fence charger. Run a strand across the top and I bet it will change his mind.

[RidgeRunner]

I have a couple of those from my previous dog. He started chewing on the transducer after he ate the harness for the lights (consumed it too). What an animal. Had to string the hot wire around the boat and it parked in the yard..
Here comes the blonde in me- There is a simple procedure for plug and play Smartcraft Monitors and gauges. First couple pages into the manual it says MASTER RESET- Pure Magic after that ... The gauge must have been previously powered up and it was confused as to who its new master IS. :haha: So I put 1.2 hours on it.. Composure, I think it is done gents...
Next is a small bathroom remodel then I can go use this baby and redouble my focus on redfish and trout.

[spareparts]

my neighbor, growing up, had an issue with his other neighbors bull dog, the dog kept peeing on his flowers(his flower garden was his wifes hobby). The dog kept killing his flowers by peeing on them or digging them. One day he took a metal trash can lid and set it down between the flowers, he hooked a long jumper wire from the trash can lid to the coil wire on his lawn mower. He hid around the corner and waited till he herd pee hitting the trash can lid, once he heard it, he pulled on the rope start for the pawn mower. Needless to say, the dog never came back in his yard. You could see that dog just stare at him from his yard, but he never came back in that yard again

[Destroyer]

my neighbor, growing up, had an issue with his other neighbors bull dog, the dog kept peeing on his flowers(his flower garden was his wifes hobby). The dog kept killing his flowers by peeing on them or digging them. One day he took a metal trash can lid and set it down between the flowers, he hooked a long jumper wire from the trash can lid to the coil wire on his lawn mower. He hid around the corner and waited till he herd pee hitting the trash can lid, once he heard it, he pulled on the rope start for the pawn mower. Needless to say, the dog never came back in his yard. You could see that dog just stare at him from his yard, but he never came back in that yard again


LOL :clap:

[THEFERMANATOR]

my neighbor, growing up, had an issue with his other neighbors bull dog, the dog kept peeing on his flowers(his flower garden was his wifes hobby). The dog kept killing his flowers by peeing on them or digging them. One day he took a metal trash can lid and set it down between the flowers, he hooked a long jumper wire from the trash can lid to the coil wire on his lawn mower. He hid around the corner and waited till he herd pee hitting the trash can lid, once he heard it, he pulled on the rope start for the pawn mower. Needless to say, the dog never came back in his yard. You could see that dog just stare at him from his yard, but he never came back in that yard again

He needed a model T FORD ignition coil. No pull starting needed, just hook it to 12 volts and she buzzes away.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATZAH70CJjY

[smokeonthewater]

wouldn't that be 6V?

[THEFERMANATOR]

wouldn't that be 6V?
No, they will buzz on 6V, but work 3 times as good on 12. Doesn't hurt em a bit as the stock T mag puts out 28-32 volts AC, so 12 volts DC don't bother em at all.

[RidgeRunner]

I don't exactly know about model T coils but the coils off the 3.8 Pontiac get your attention.

Performance numbers thus far

It is debatable as to what speed the boat will plane. Without a doubt it is on plane at 12 MPH at 2200 RPM (I believe 10.6 at 2100)
MPH RPM
15.5 2500 2.1 GPH
20.5 3000 2.2 GPH
26 3500 ?
30 4000 2.9 GPH
35 4500 ?
39 5000 5.4 GPH
42 5600 ?
46 6100 ?
I got 2.2 hours on the clock and I opened her up.
MPG is going to be real good as you can tell.

PSA *** PLEASE READ ***
This is not bragging guys I am dead serious, please take it in the way it was meant from the bottom of my heart and soul.. As a matter of fact, it could be said that I am a blooming idiot (albeit very lucky) and should be embarrassed for admitting to such lax behavior..
I have had this vessel for 18 years. I have had numerous other boats V-bottom, flat bottom, offshore, inshore, flats, bay, airboat. I worked at a landlocked Marina off and on for 10 years as a lot boy and worked my way up to chief screw-off whereby I lake tested a variety of boats. Bass boats to 70 mph were not common but I could be the steering wheel holder if such a vessel came my way. My boss held many a title in tunnel boats and knew a thing about how hulls work. I picked up on some as you might imagine. I am not an expert but my experience with motor boats is perhaps a bit more than others is the point.
I would have never predicted any bad behavior from this boat. BUT
AT speeds above 40 mph this boat wants to chuck you out. A combination of those loose motor mounts, a little play in the steering, having a big lower unit buried in the water, high trim angle and hammer down (at or above 5000 rpm) and hold on to your a$$. It was as if I am testing an old familiar set of shoes gentleman. Wait, WTF just happened? The bow will start to rise and fly and then the motor moves to one side and hang on, you just changed course by 10 degrees and the boat is doing a version of chine walking. (I was lucky) Yes that kill switch and life vest are on board for a reason. I slowed down and put on both and proceeded with caution... Spareparts and I agree that the boat would have been properly powered with a 70 hp motor. As he put it "You wouldn't be satisfied until you put enough hp on it that it could kill you."
STUFF HAPPENS-- ALWAYS Be alert and prepared for the unexpected
WEAR YOUR VEST AND USE THE SAFETY LANYARD !

[smokeonthewater]

Woah! ..... Glad ur ok!... I wonder if moving some weight forward would help? Also maybe some sort of shock to stabilize the motor mounts like a steering stabilizer for a performance bike? I'm sure you know a dual cable steering system would tighten it up too.

WOW! 10 mpg??? Is that even possible? ..... Very impressive!!!


No, they will buzz on 6V, but work 3 times as good on 12. Doesn't hurt em a bit as the stock T mag puts out 28-32 volts AC, so 12 volts DC don't bother em at all.

Didnt know that.... Very cool.

[RidgeRunner]

Steering play is 95% of the side to side action. You are correct Smoke single cable steering simply has too much play to go real fast.

[THEFERMANATOR]

You can always put a BAYSTAR steering kit on it. They aren't that horribly priced(compared to the SEASTAR system), and should be more than enough for that 115. Sounds like you need more HP. You need enough to push through the scary spot to get to the even faster speeds.

[RidgeRunner]

Nah, I'll pass on that. I was there when this vessel was built. It isn't designed properly to pack air and it never will be safe at ludicrous speed. It is too thin for that kind of pressure and I don't have a death wish. The good news is there are a plethora of real simple solutions to something like this. The least costly is to back off the go-go stick. OR If you jack the engine up with the jack plate 2.5" the problem goes away and she flys straight. Prop change will certainly change the driving behavior too. The motor will barely touch the limiter with the 21p Thunderbolt prop. (motor trimmed and jacked to the proper safe?? attitude..) I think I am going to try a 4-or5 blade prop just to see if the mileage is any different.

I still can't believe I finally bit the bullet and went 4-stroke, and new. I freakin hate payments, but I love the new engine too. It is starting to sink in. The quiet is starting to make me horny, kinda like the smell of 2-stroke oil..:oh:

[THEFERMANATOR]

If you have a hub kit, I have a HIGH FIVE old style(doesn't have the vent holes in it) 21 pitch you can try out. I swapped to the TROPHY PLUS when I had my flats boat to get more top end, but this HIGH FIVE got on plane in a HURRY! I could throw people back onto the deck unless I gave them a rope to hang onto. If it works out I'm sure I can work out a deal you'd be happy with.

[RidgeRunner]

Ferman, that is a great offer that I will take you up on. That is one of the ones I want to try as it happens. When they first came out in like 1987 we used to rig them on Carolina Skiffs with the 90 hp motors (smaller case) You could surface them and keep the boat moving across some very shallow waters. I recall they were very good on holding plane slow and I see that they have a following now from the ski boat crowd. Must have some good bite. Someone on S&F has one for sale, but I want to try one first. I was thinking of calling Ken @ Prop Gods and see what he thinks as well. You solved one problem. Maybe we could get together and get Patrick to the water for some fishing/swimming/testing.
Based on preliminary testing and some initial numbers, I believe it will be hard to top the 21P Thunderbolt. It is just a great prop (Mirage Copy without the Vent holes). Maybe the ECO Enertia like Big Shrimpin posted the other day. He gained 3 or 4 MPH at the same RPM switching from a Mirage to a one pitch higher Enertia. I really really want to try a Maximus straight tube. IIRC it has the Tempest blade rake and shape and the diffuser ring cut off would help give less stern lift. How about a 21 Chopper? Lots of choices..

[THEFERMANATOR]

I know when I ran the high five I have it was like a rocket out of the hole. Boat came up almost level without tabs. It gave a good deal of stern lift, and wasn't able to lift the bow much even trimmed up. It did hold plane at low speeds like nobodies business, and actually planed out slower than the TROPHY did. The reason I took it off was the boat hit a wall at 50. 1 or 5 people on board, it didn't matter, 52 was as fast as it would go(but it got there QUICK!). I was thinking maybe I could bum a ride or 2 with yeah, and call it a deal. It isn't doing me any good, just taking up space in my shed. As for taking Patrick, I don't think he would sit still long enough to do anything. He's an atomic rubber ball bouncing off the walls all day.

[RidgeRunner]

Great offer Ferman, I will take you up on that. No boating this weekend. Lots of soccer and a minor relapse of gut hurting.. :nut:

[RidgeRunner]

Made it through the day. I hate food all over again.. 182 and falling fast
I was in Bass Pro Sunday walking around people watching and I noticed a guy walking around over by the boats that had the same kind of shirt that I was wearing, didn't think twice about it until I got a little closer and realized it was my own reflection in the glass. Scary when you don't recognize yourself in the mirror. BTW- They had ZERO selection in the Hydraulic Steering Department.. I think my marina has the Baystar at $650

Sucks cutting fresh ty-wraps. Just when you thought it was over and done with.. Everything, and I mean every wire in the boat is ty-wrapped to the freaking steering cable. I used the steering head to mount a couple terminal blocks for power distribution. No more cable steering means I will need to do a little more reconfiguring,, v1

[smokeonthewater]

lol just cut off the ends of the cable and rename it a "wire guide"

[THEFERMANATOR]

Theres several on ebay for under $550

[spareparts]

Jamestown Distributors has the best price on Hydraulic steering

[RidgeRunner]

On it.. Thanks for the leads

[RidgeRunner]

Jamestown is $575 plus the ride. I think another thousand sounds about right

BOAThousand

[bradford]

I've found a thousand isn't too bad, usually ends up being more.

[RidgeRunner]

That is SPIN right there. The bright side is it will be a thousand or less.

Got it.. Train the brain:beer:

[RidgeRunner]

New steering installed and it took out all but the smallest of play in the steering. Lake test revealed that the issue where the boat was misbehaving has been resolved. Speed run of 46 mph with two people on board. Ferman, I didn't get to lake test your props yet. With the additional person I could tell the holeshot was a little slower and the lowest speed to stay on plane went up to 13.5 mph.
A quick snapshot at cruise of
30MPH 4GPH Fuel burn for 7.5MPG -- That is what the Mercury tests showed for 3500 rpm on their test mules too..
What a PITA taking out the old steering. As I already suspected there were no place to tie wires once the old cable and head were out of the way. I cut and fit a 6"tall x 30"wide piece of 1/2" Starboard with 15 ty-wrap holders and a place to mount the junction box. From there I cut all the old wire ties and straighted out each and every harness for the third or fourth time now. (LAST I HOPE) I am so happy I took the extra time to do so as it is the best rendition yet... :happy: Now it is FN DONE I said it. Labor of love the first time. Second time, not so much. :news:

[bradford]

Glad to hear she's coming together for you Ridge.

[RidgeRunner]

I see that there were a few people checking out this thread. I get wordy fast as you know. ??IDK what to say??
Thanks Bradford. Yes it is coming together. Save for the all important prop selection. I know you can appreciate the feeling of accomplishment you have at the end of a project. When the late and over-budget object of my wonderlust has had the last screw tightened and hatch battened, THEN WHAT?

I TELL YOU WHAT>> SEE YOU IN THE FISHIN SECTION...

[bradford]

I've found that they are never really completely finished. Always something new to add. I still need to install nav lights, finally just installed a new gps/sounder, it's almost time to redo the varnish on some of the teak, and I'm thinking about swapping my bow rail for the two piece one off the Chris Craft to work better with the bow pulpit. Want to put my deck drains through the back of the liner too instead of through the deck, and also add some hatches to give better access to the drains and scuppers.

Nothing but time and money, break out another thousand. The important thing is she's usable!

[phatdaddy]

i've been checking it out also ridge. i got the v back from the dealer with the new 4s 150 on monday. got the new dash in, electronics mounted, new fuel tank, all new hoses, fill, vent, & fuel. now the break in & prop dial in. hope i'm as happy as you are.

[RidgeRunner]

I am going to predict, you will be happy. Mezmerized by the quiet power, momma is going to love it and fuel mileage is a fixin to go through the roof.
I just have one more repair to make on the V (Bradford is so right, it never ends), meanwhile the honey-do list is shrinking at the same time. Win-Win Add another win putting some slime on the deck. :beer:

[phatdaddy]

put 2,5 hours on it this morning. definatly not in kansas anymore. very strong motor, seems to have a lot or torque at any rpm. i was loaded light, myself, safety gear, and 30 gallons of gas. topped out ay 5400 rpm 41mph. would have gone faster, just can't leave it at wot too long yet. put 35 miles on it, burned 8 gallon of gas.

[bradford]

Sweet, good to hear Phat!

[RidgeRunner]

I made it to the lake to try Ferman's 21P High Five prop. It is on plane in an instant and will stay on plane down to 11 MPH with two people on board so it wins in that department. It isn't as efficient as the 21P Thunderbolt 3 blade but it is real close. Top end was 44 and MPG of 7.1 at 3500 RPM running 26 MPH. The biggest difference is noticed in the mid-range punch. It was very smooth. I never ran the jack plate up, it was just an easy cruise for the most part.

[spareparts]

what was hte max rpm at WOT? 23P High Five perhaps?

[THEFERMANATOR]

I made it to the lake to try Ferman's 21P High Five prop. It is on plane in an instant and will stay on plane down to 11 MPH with two people on board so it wins in that department. It isn't as efficient as the 21P Thunderbolt 3 blade but it is real close. Top end was 44 and MPG of 7.1 at 3500 RPM running 26 MPH. The biggest difference is noticed in the mid-range punch. It was very smooth. I never ran the jack plate up, it was just an easy cruise for the most part.
Figured it would work well for you. The high five was great for getting on plane, and held good, just didn't have much speed to it. It ran 50-52 on my PROLINE with just me in it, or 5 of us in it.

[RidgeRunner]

The High Five hit the limiter harder than the other 21P. It started cutting out cylinders (not so soft either) but that is with trim.

[THEFERMANATOR]

The High Five hit the limiter harder than the other 21P. It started cutting out cylinders (not so soft either) but that is with trim.
Sounds like it needs more prop, or more cup in the 21. At least now you have a baseline to go off of instead of buying one blind.

[RidgeRunner]

I'm buying yours iffin you don't mind. LOL! By the time I get a fishing load and all my catch I will need the extra RRRR's It is a remarkable piece. I don't think a 23 will be doable.

[THEFERMANATOR]

I'm buying yours iffin you don't mind. LOL! By the time I get a fishing load and all my catch I will need the extra RRRR's It is a remarkable piece. I don't think a 23 will be doable.
You can try that other one out to and see how it works. I think it was supposed to be close to a TEMPEST, just made by PRECISION. I would say the offer to trade out for a feeshin trip or 2 still stands, but I doubt you want whatever funk is on me getting on your boat. Last trip out I only got 1 trout, and didn't fair much better yesterday. It was such a slow day I kept a bluefish:sick:. Fishing in the backwaters north of Chas for redfish on an oyster bed, and hook up with a 20" bluefish. I then catch a 22" jack on the backside of it(and about 20 more out on the flats). I did end up picking up 4 small trout on 2 other bars on the edge of the bay. I keep seeing reds, can't get one to touch any of my lures for nothing.

[RidgeRunner]

I think you are too hard on yourself. You got a good trashcan slam.. That is better than the luck I had for sure..
While I was testing the prop, some lowlife SOB stole my blower and weed eater out of the garage. Wife and daughter were home at the time. Garage door was open, two trucks in the driveway. Someone just wandered up and decided they wanted them more than me...so I would rather lick a sailcat than to come home to that... Lets hope karma catches up to the lowly thief before anyone profits from the deal. Sorry to rant but I fear that black cloud is still looming over my head. It is you that should take the money and run my friend, standing next to me at this point is HIGH RISK. I will gladly take you fishing, multiple times if you dare, that is a real good offer. BUT that might be a bit too generous. Yikes props are $$$BIG$$$$. We will definitely work something out. :beer:

[THEFERMANATOR]

I caught sailcats on my last 3 trips, but none this one. What really got me was I lost a GOOD trout right at the boat. I had bought a DOA deadly combo to try out, and hooked up. Got right to the boat and he got away. Pulled it in and the jig was gone, the knot had come untied. So much for them being pre rigged and ready to use, and shame on me for not retying them. Pulled out another one, and it fell off just taking it out of the bag. And I almost got a 3 foot shark that was chewing on one of my jacks, and I couldn't escape the dolphins for the life of me.

Sounds like we could make for an interesting day on the water.

[Destroyer]

Sounds like we could make for an interesting day on the water.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLIaISHu2Mo :rain: :you:

[RidgeRunner]

Umbrella would keep some of the flying poop from hitting home.. just sayin:embarsed::beer::you:

[THEFERMANATOR]

I was expecting to see this one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXL_ufssqcc

[RidgeRunner]

Went to the bay last night with the NV Skiff. Never got out of Cockroach Bay. Going out the channel had me jumping waves in the dark. First one over the bow had me heading toward shelter.. Did I mention it was clear and a little windy. I wish you all could have seen the sunset it was red and spectacular as always.. I proceeded to freeze half to death in my half wet clothes until the trash fish started to bite. Slept in the boat due to boredom. Got in late, boat to clean. I think I logged another 10 minutes on the hour meter. Burned another ounce of fuel.. It is bad when your weed eater has more hours than the boat.. just saying

[phatdaddy]

glad ya got to go out. sounds like your getting it dialed in. i've got 15 hours on mine, 135 miles & burned 31 gallons of gas.
lotta that is trolling. these things love to troll.

[THEFERMANATOR]

I'm hoping to head out next weekend. I was good boy this weekend and took the wife to her 10 year class reunion, so hopefully that means I can get a pass to go next weekend. Onoy seems fair since it is the weekend before my birthday.

[RidgeRunner]

I went fishing but couldn't do it during prime time, or daylight hours for that matter. Soccer Friday night practice, Saturday noon pictures and 2:00 game. Sunday was the Harvest Hollar Corn Maze for 4 hours, after washing the boat and taking care of a few chores around the house. Somewhere in there I put in for a nap, cat nap in the boat was OK but not long enough. Ferman, I will check next weekends schedule, might skip out on a game if you want to go fishin.. my treat/payback for prop. I will call or send a PM when I know what is going on.

[THEFERMANATOR]

I went fishing but couldn't do it during prime time, or daylight hours for that matter. Soccer Friday night practice, Saturday noon pictures and 2:00 game. Sunday was the Harvest Hollar Corn Maze for 4 hours, after washing the boat and taking care of a few chores around the house. Somewhere in there I put in for a nap, cat nap in the boat was OK but not long enough. Ferman, I will check next weekends schedule, might skip out on a game if you want to go fishin.. my treat/payback for prop. I will call or send a PM when I know what is going on.
Let me know, I've been checking the weather, and they're forecasting the wind to blow next weekend.

[RidgeRunner]

Sorry Ferman, it did blow all weekend as you said.. We will plan something soon..
Suwannee was last weekend, I tried a 23P Tempest with vent holes and it had too much slip down low to be efficient. Better top end at 46 MPH, so off it came and I put the High Five back on it. High Five has the best holeshot by a mile. So far the 21 Mirage is the most efficient in the MPG department. I averaged 6.5 MPG for the weekend. What an improvement. I would normally burn 24 plus gallons to go up river and back. Now I can do it on 11 gallons. (75 plus miles)

[THEFERMANATOR]

Sorry Ferman, it did blow all weekend as you said.. We will plan something soon..
Suwannee was last weekend, I tried a 23P Tempest with vent holes and it had too much slip down low to be efficient. Better top end at 46 MPH, so off it came and I put the High Five back on it. High Five has the best holeshot by a mile. So far the 21 Mirage is the most efficient in the MPG department. I averaged 6.5 MPG for the weekend. What an improvement. I would normally burn 24 plus gallons to go up river and back. Now I can do it on 11 gallons. (75 plus miles)
It's hard to beat teh high five for holeshot. That sucker would LAUNCH out. Should have felt it on the 18 PROLINE I had with the XFI MERC on the back.

[RidgeRunner]

I wasn't running it real hard, but then again, I was the slowest on the river even at full tilt. Scream and Fly was on the Suwannee. I was passed a couple times over (up and down the river) by the entire fleet of over 100 go-fast boats. It was as impressive of a turnout as I ever seen. I saw a lot more of the river than normal because my favorite and most used cruise speed for the cooler temps we were having was 26 MPH.. burning a mere 3.2 up river and 3.1 down stream. Probably some small rpm difference in there due to the current which was 3 MPH in places. If I never raised the speed above 26 I could have made the trip in a little over 9 gallons. That speed and fuel burn tops the best test Mercury has shown in any of their tests to date. That is better than expected and I must say, I said it out loud but never fully expected mileage to be this good. Had I opted for the 70 Yamaha it would have made fuel... :part::love:

[bradford]

Sounds like you're getting her dialed in Ridge. Good to hear your reports!