Why is 200 hp a bit much for Vs ?

[bgreene]

Curious about perfomance characteristics with a 200hp, assuming 2 stroke so weight not the issue.

I've read some threads suggesting 150/175hp " perfect" while 200 hp a bit much.

Why ? Does the boat tend to porpoise at high speed with a 200hp ? ( bow go up and down continually )
Is it a weight issue ?
Does the stern dig in too deep when lifting up onto plane ?

Appreciate some feedback, thanks

[THEFERMANATOR]

Pretty much boils down to a 175 will push you almost as fast as a 200 will. Once you go above 175HP you really don't see a big gain in performace as a 175 can push the boat about as fast as the hull was designed to go.

[willy]

They handle a 200 2 stroke just fine, they say a 150n is best all around due to overall balance of the hull and mostly because you get great fuel economy and great performance out of one.
These hulls do not need max power to perform very well and carry a substantial load.

[tsubaki]

What FERM and willy said!!
I had almost finished a 2 page explanation, they did it much better!

[willy]

Yea but you would have had a great picture with yours Tsubaki, I should have shut up and waited!!

[draglink]

I'm running a 200 Merc and my V performs GREAT( zero porpoise, stern does not dig in at all)....I've seen 53 mph on GPS. Im sure they run great with a 150, but I would LOVE to hang a Yammie 250 2 stroke V-Max on the back!

[RidgeRunner]

You know I like fast but the opportunities to go fast are few and far between. I third or fourth Willy & FERM. Additionally I think a lightweight 4-stroke would be a strong consideration for me.

[draglink]

Yeah I get your point Ridge...Im lucky where I live(Lower Chesapeake) if the weather is good, I can run WOT as long as the engine and my wallet can stand it!

[willy]

Once in a blue moon for me on Raritan Bay or the ocean around the tip of the Hook to run WOT.

[Skools Out]

friend of mine had his v out Sat for the first time and the motor first time since my rebuild and it ran great numbers no porpoise at all your motor isn't set right on your transom then it is to deep most likely. his has a 200 evinrude and it ran out with 15 x 17 ss prop 5500 rpm @ 49 mph and 2 adults 3 grade school kids.

[draglink]

no porpoise at all your motor isn't set right on your transom then it is to deep most likely.


Hey Skool, Im so used to running Makos that tend to have some porpoise when trimmed all the way...I cant get my V to porpoise even if I try.....to me I need to get the bow up a little more. I have studied the motor height and had my engine builder look at it also(He races outboards) and it looks perfect. I think next time she is on the trailer I may raise it a notch.....may take an hour or so....just to see what happens

[draglink]

Oh and the batteries are up in the console.....What do yall think....will raising the motor actually get my bow higher?



SORRY FOR THE HIJACK!!!

[Skools Out]

yeah it should um you need a long straight edge to put on the bottom of the hull to the motor then trim the motor as low as it will go and see where your straight edge hits the lower unit. it should be 1 inch above the trim plate on the foot. at the back closest to the transom.

[reelapeelin]

IMO 200 is the perfect HP for most 20' hulls, V20s included...it's amatter of WHICH 200HP you select...so far, I haven;t seen a better match for the V20 than a small-block 200HP Etec...I think Lumberslinger will agree...

If I had to pick 4-stroke power for a V20, right now it'd be a 175 Zuke...and that's only because Honda doesn't make a 175...

[RidgeRunner]

I agree with Reel too.
Draglink, I found that to get the bow to fly setback and prop choice tends to help. Trying to be a voice of reason here. I see your V-max and raise you a 300xs. Just not sure how the old girl will react.. Still playing with it.(and the boat too) :sun: BGREEN has created a monster, they were never designed to go real fast. Nobody has come forth to say they found the speed at which the boat becomes unstable/unsafe.
BTW- with that crew you had aboard last weekend, it ain't gonna go too fast, nor get the bow to fly without some serious hp. Any captain worth his salt would trade speed for some PYT with glow sticks all day long.

[bgreene]

Hum.........for maximum " realistic" speed - meaning engine that's not too heavy........
I'd agree with the small block etec 200 hp.......

I'd also suggest an Optimax 225, prop'd and trimmed just right may push a good V 20/21 to 55-60mph light load.

That's nice speed because when it's truly flat, you could " cruise" at 40 - 45mph.

Nice.

[Genie Aye]

Hum.........for maximum " realistic" speed - meaning engine that's not too heavy........
I'd agree with the small block etec 200 hp.......

I'd also suggest an Optimax 225, prop'd and trimmed just right may push a good V 20/21 to 55-60mph light load.

That's nice speed because when it's truly flat, you could " cruise" at 40 - 45mph.

Nice.

The Optimax is not going to give you 55 to 60mph---besides--you do not want this boat that fast--When I had mine at max around 53 fully trimmed out--it is getting scarey--40 to 45 is real comfy.
The Big 200ho E-Tec is actually 218 at the prop--so a 225 will not do it--LOL.

The reason I said the 175HP E-Tec instead of the 200 Small E-tec--I do not like being at the top of the HP range for any motor. That is why I have the Big 200HO E-Tec.

[reelapeelin]

Ridge...aboard your CC w/250 HP I never felt any squirrelyness to the ride at all...I don't really know if you were WOT or what top speed we were runnin, but I know it was FAST...VERY fast...felt stable to me...

Genie, I hear what you mean about being at the top HP range for a given motor...and maybe I am over confident about BRP's engineering capabilities, but I would hang a smallblock 200 Etec on a boat in a heartbeat...I'm pretty sure they wouldn't shoot themselves by going to market w/a fly-apart motor that hasn't been tested extensively...OMC in past days would; they proved that w/the early FICHT and where'd that get 'em...Bombardier has better sense...

[draglink]

I have a good friend with a '74 center console V that he totally rebuilt with composite stringers, floor and transom...she is a lot lighter now. He went with the E-Tech 200SB. He easily sees 55+ and at cruising speed she almost makes fuel!

Mine at 53 was very comfortable, wasnt squirrely at all

She really is nice cruising at 40, but usually keep her around 35-37 range to save a little fuel and keep my crew happy

[RidgeRunner]

Never wide open on our trips Reel. Besides, it won't achieve breakneck speed with the 23P prop until you lighten the load. Heavy load I see mid 50's Summer prop is a 21p Lightning that is close to the Mirage prop. Better mileage and tops out in the high 50's but is a better all round prop for fishing and cruising with a little more snap out of the hole. The 225 Optimax is pretty strong Genie Aye, I have a friend that replaced his twin 250's EFI with twin Optimax 225's with the same lower unit gears and he ran out of prop. I am not disputing the prowess of the 200 HO, I would take that in a heartbeat. Perhaps the difference lies in the center console versus cuddy on MPH?
Porpoise is non existent with normal trim angles, even with 30" setback. And I think the 250 is pushing 500 lbs.

[Genie Aye]

There is no question that the 225Optimax is strong--the Optimax series fro Mercury is probably one of the best they have ever built and strong---What is was after was 218 vs 225hp is not enough to make that speed difference.

Maybe it is just the way my V-20 is set up and the water is was on---It was a bit on the rough side--2 to 3 foot boat chop. I have had here opened up at just over 53mph on GPS on smooth water and no stability issue's but I my self would not run here around all the time at that speed. BRP is pretty good on the making sure they do not blow up--but--I ride their Snowmobiles as well and have watched them use the consumer for their testing center--I can say that my motor has been great other than the injector issue's--apparently BRP had issues with soldering joints inside the injectors in the 07 models---but am very happy with their(BRP) resilute way of handleing the issue---they have replaced all of my injectors at NO cost!!! That is coverage that makes you feel good for sure.

And yes--I have alot on my boat---Downrigger weights (60lbs+) fishing gear, emergency equipment, rigging, multiple anchors, Head, etc.

[Skools Out]

Never wide open on our trips Reel. Besides, it won't achieve breakneck speed with the 23P prop until you lighten the load. Heavy load I see mid 50's Summer prop is a 21p Lightning that is close to the Mirage prop. Better mileage and tops out in the high 50's but is a better all round prop for fishing and cruising with a little more snap out of the hole. The 225 Optimax is pretty strong Genie Aye, I have a friend that replaced his twin 250's EFI with twin Optimax 225's with the same lower unit gears and he ran out of prop. I am not disputing the prowess of the 200 HO, I would take that in a heartbeat. Perhaps the difference lies in the center console versus cuddy on MPH?
Porpoise is non existent with normal trim angles, even with 30" setback. And I think the 250 is pushing 500 lbs.

:head:

your prop info makes no since, it's totally backwards, a higher pitch prop adds speed and hurts bottom end take off so your 23 pitch should go faster than your 21.

[RidgeRunner]

Not this time. Re-read. These are my observations.
You assumed mid 50's was the top-end with the larger pitch prop.

Speed prop 23P Tempest Plus does go faster, best I have seen is 63 MPH last February on the Suwannee. The best speed was obtained Boat Light, trimmed to the moon and some trim tab, motor turning 5800 on the limiter, down stream, 78 degrees, humidity 75%. Tons of propslip but it gets the bow way up. Same prop with 4 or five people in 90 degree weather and 95% humidity will only run 54 mph and the motor will only turn approx 5500 RPM trimmed to the max. Slightly too much prop for fishing load or skiing.

The 21 Lightning (Mirage copy) has huge round ears with lots of bite, and is slower on the top end I think it was 58mph (light load, trimmed proper and on the limiter). Summer prop because the 95 plus degree days hurts the performance on this EFI 250 compared to the cool winter months when it runs best. The smaller pitch prop carries the load of four or five people with less strain while allowing the motor to turn more RPM at WOT . Economy is better because the motor isn't being lugged around at every RPM range.

In theory you are right that higher pitch props add speed but only if you powerplant has the balls to turn the prop. The 25P Tempest on my shelf was no faster that the 23P because the motor could not achieve the necessary rpm to make that a reality. Fuel economy sucked worse than normal but it would cruise 40 at 4000 rpm and 50 at 5000 rpm

[RidgeRunner]

Genie Aye, is the Optimax 225hp dead on at the prop or does the 10% rule apply?

[bgreene]

Ok, now I'm upping the ante....... the new Yami " lightweight " 300hp 4 stroke.

And if someone has a problem with that......lets put that new 556 hp outboard on a nice V21. You know - this new 1,000lb motor. First V21 ever to run .....70 +

[draglink]

Hey Bgreen, you buy that Caddy for me and I'll bolt 'er on and try her!

[bgreene]

I just re read this post - interesting info about performance and prop's.....

[Fitz]

I think 200hp is a really good match for the V20 hull. My 1975 hull is rated for 230hp (twin 115s in the day), and I find that 200 gives it ample power under any circumstances. It planes effortlessly and economically at 3,200 rpms, even with a good load. Unless the engine you're considering is very heavy, I don't think you'll be disappointed with a 200.

I have a 1989 Evinrude 200XP that weighs 450lbs. I run a 14.5 x 18 stainless prop. When I first bought the boat I experimented with some other props, but I settled on this one and have never run anything else. I use the boat for a wide range of activities – cruising, skiing, tubing, and inshore and offshore fishing, and I regularly carry several people and a lot of gear. The 14.5 x 18 prop doesn't give me the fastest speed or best mileage, but I'm more interested in all-around performance. I can always run at least 47mph even with a full load, and I can always run in the specified 5,000 - 6,000 max rpm range for my engine. That combination also provides immediate response and superb torque whenever I have to hammer it to get through a nasty inlet.

If my engine ever dies I'm going to repower with a 200 small block Etec. It has a little less displacement, but it's very close in weight to what I'm currently running and from everything I've read the difference will be negligible. That said, I do hope I get many more years out of my sometimes thirsty but otherwise very reliable and powerful engine.

[Fitz]

To answer your two other questions - I've never experienced any porpoising or stern dig at all. My engine has a foil that was installed by the previous owner, so that may have something to do with modulating my boat's planing pattern, but I can't say for sure because I've never run without it.

[Genie Aye]

Genie Aye, is the Optimax 225hp dead on at the prop or does the 10% rule apply?


I beleive that is at the prop.

[bgreene]

I think 200hp is a really good match for the V20 hull. My 1975 hull is rated for 230hp (twin 115s in the day), and I find that 200 gives it ample power under any circumstances. It planes effortlessly and economically at 3,200 rpms, even with a good load. Unless the engine you're considering is very heavy, I don't think you'll be disappointed with a 200.

I have a 1989 Evinrude 200XP that weighs 450lbs. I run a 14.5 x 18 stainless prop. When I first bought the boat I experimented with some other props, but I settled on this one and have never run anything else. I use the boat for a wide range of activities – cruising, skiing, tubing, and inshore and offshore fishing, and I regularly carry several people and a lot of gear. The 14.5 x 18 prop doesn't give me the fastest speed or best mileage, but I'm more interested in all-around performance. I can always run at least 47mph even with a full load, and I can always run in the specified 5,000 - 6,000 max rpm range for my engine. That combination also provides immediate response and superb torque whenever I have to hammer it to get through a nasty inlet.

If my engine ever dies I'm going to repower with a 200 small block Etec. It has a little less displacement, but it's very close in weight to what I'm currently running and from everything I've read the difference will be negligible. That said, I do hope I get many more years out of my sometimes thirsty but otherwise very reliable and powerful engine.

Go for the HO .........

[captpete13]

I have a 225 Optimax on my V. Right now I'm running a Merc Revolution 4 prop with 19" pitch. My top end is 53mph occasionally hitting the rev limiter. But the cruise is perfect. 30kts at 4000 rpms and getting 3.5mpg.

[bgreene]

Yeh well I changed my mind on that one - and went for the HO.

Now someone tell me where the switch is.........to dial it up to 250 hp!

225 Opti is known as a top speed motor - both etec and merc 225's putting out closer to 265 hp at the prop.

[THEFERMANATOR]

Yeh well I changed my mind on that one - and went for the HO.

Now someone tell me where the switch is.........to dial it up to 250 hp!

225 Opti is known as a top speed motor - both etec and merc 225's putting out closer to 265 hp at the prop.

245, 265 would get them in trouble with the insurance industry as you have to be within 10% of the rated HP. As for turning it up, it isn't that simple on the new ETECS. Pretty sure there is porting differences in them like MERCURY did.

[captpete13]

went out fishing today and managed to get a pic of all the info on speed and fuel burn.I'm lovin my Opti.
http://i1087.photobucket.com/albums/j467/captpete13/photobucket-22852-1372891063390_zpse76883ae.jpg (http://s1087.photobucket.com/user/captpete13/media/photobucket-22852-1372891063390_zpse76883ae.jpg.html)

[reelapeelin]

went out fishing today and managed to get a pic of all the info on speed and fuel burn.I'm lovin my Opti.
http://i1087.photobucket.com/albums/j467/captpete13/photobucket-22852-1372891063390_zpse76883ae.jpg (http://s1087.photobucket.com/user/captpete13/media/photobucket-22852-1372891063390_zpse76883ae.jpg.html)

Sweet numbers on a V!!...:part:

[Striper80]

My uncle has an 89 v20 cuddy with a 225 Yamaha 2 stroke and it hauls ***. He had a 130 on it but blew the power head. His mechanic had the engine as a fresh rebuild so he gave him a good price. All he does is ***** about how the thing eats gas now though.

[Destroyer]

My uncle has an 89 v20 cuddy with a 225 Yamaha 2 stroke and it hauls ***. He had a 130 on it but blew the power head. His mechanic had the engine as a fresh rebuild so he gave him a good price. All he does is ***** about how the thing eats gas now though.

You never get something for nothing. More power demands more gas. It's as simple as that.

Nice looking numbers Pete. And a good looking dash setup as well.

[spareparts]

Pete, I'm surprised your not spinning at least a 21 on that opti

[RidgeRunner]

[QUOTE=Destroyer;212677]You never get something for nothing. More power demands more gas. It's as simple as that.


Agreed, except When you step into some technology like the Opti and the Etec.
The trade-off is that the engine is so much more complex. Same and more hp with less fuel burn.
I can just about see Spongebob now. Jetting across the harbor with that new powerplant.. Sweet dash job too capt Pete.

We need another get together. We can race up the ICW for pinks.. We will give the Yamaha guys a head start, Wilson. Then maybe we can get some of the closer folks to attend. Hu Hum! Stop in Savannah with a camera as we convoy from there to the show.. Mount Pleasant, Shem Creek, Wando, Fishin with some good ole snaggers.. Man it has been too long.

[captpete13]

Pete, I'm surprised your not spinning at least a 21 on that opti

I tested out a few different 21's. They didn't offer that much more performance for me to go out and buy one. Since I got the Rev 4 for free I'm gonna stick with that. I ran the boat on Friday in a little chop and got 56 mph with a full tank of fuel and trimmed all the way up. I'm pretty happy with that.
Destroyer, The dash is a little different now. I got a Garmin 740s now. But my cruise numbers are the same. 3-almost4 mpg. And all that power.

[bgreene]

That's some serious speed with a full fuel tank, and excellent cruise range.

I may be tweeking a little more..... delayed in tuning the prop for another 200-400 rpm, but still may if I can find good shop that isn't buried with props now.